The Last Of Us I HBO I Season 1
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Finished the show today. Very solid 8/10 for me, Clive. As good an adaptation in most respects as you could wish for, because they nail the two things that are most important: Joel and Ellie. Pascal and Ramsey are excellent, and particularly in Joel’s case are improved from the game because the calibre of performance is improved. They do a very good job of humanising Joel - the conversation with Tommy for instance, or his revelation in the finale - to compensate for the fact that much of the attachment to him in the game is because you play as him, when in reality he’s mostly just a gruff badass hero wish fulfilment avatar. That works when you’re going about shooting things over twenty hours - the changes here are necessary and work a lot better in the context of the adaptation.
There are two real flaws - one fairly minor, one pretty major. The first is the lack of infected, especially post-Kansas. Mazin and Druckmann lean far too much into ‘humans are the real monsters after all’; it’s the perennial threat of clickers that sustains a lot of the tension in the game. Fingers crossed set pieces like the snow horde, the hotel, the car park all stay in later seasons; we need to be reminded more often that they exist as a threat.
The bigger one is the change to Ellie’s back story; this episode makes pretty clear that Ellie is immune because of the circumstances of her birth and that the cure is almost a sure thing. That weakens firstly the random happenstance of Ellie’s immunity making her more unique - if the Fireflies know this is what happened, would you put it past them letting infected bite pregnant women deliberately to make a ‘cure baby’?
More impactful however is the stripping away of the ambiguity. The reason the game’s ending works is despite Joel making that horrifying choice, the possibility exists that the cure would not have worked. Here, it makes it pretty clear it would have. This means it becomes less of a Sophie’s Choice type deal and more of a selfish act. It’s by far weaker than the game because of the lack of ambiguity, and needs Pascal and Ramsey to sell it heavily.
Part II is far more interesting from a story perspective, but also far choppier and meandering. Really interested to see how they do it.
There are two real flaws - one fairly minor, one pretty major. The first is the lack of infected, especially post-Kansas. Mazin and Druckmann lean far too much into ‘humans are the real monsters after all’; it’s the perennial threat of clickers that sustains a lot of the tension in the game. Fingers crossed set pieces like the snow horde, the hotel, the car park all stay in later seasons; we need to be reminded more often that they exist as a threat.
The bigger one is the change to Ellie’s back story; this episode makes pretty clear that Ellie is immune because of the circumstances of her birth and that the cure is almost a sure thing. That weakens firstly the random happenstance of Ellie’s immunity making her more unique - if the Fireflies know this is what happened, would you put it past them letting infected bite pregnant women deliberately to make a ‘cure baby’?
More impactful however is the stripping away of the ambiguity. The reason the game’s ending works is despite Joel making that horrifying choice, the possibility exists that the cure would not have worked. Here, it makes it pretty clear it would have. This means it becomes less of a Sophie’s Choice type deal and more of a selfish act. It’s by far weaker than the game because of the lack of ambiguity, and needs Pascal and Ramsey to sell it heavily.
Part II is far more interesting from a story perspective, but also far choppier and meandering. Really interested to see how they do it.
By n8 dogg Go To PostFinished the show today. Very solid 8/10 for me, Clive. As good an adaptation in most respects as you could wish for, because they nail the two things that are most important: Joel and Ellie. Pascal and Ramsey are excellent, and particularly in Joel’s case are improved from the game because the calibre of performance is improved. They do a very good job of humanising Joel - the conversation with Tommy for instance, or his revelation in the finale - to compensate for the fact that much of the attachment to him in the game is because you play as him, when in reality he’s mostly just a gruff badass hero wish fulfilment avatar. That works when you’re going about shooting things over twenty hours - the changes here are necessary and work a lot better in the context of the adaptation.
There are two real flaws - one fairly minor, one pretty major. The first is the lack of infected, especially post-Kansas. Mazin and Druckmann lean far too much into ‘humans are the real monsters after all’; it’s the perennial threat of clickers that sustains a lot of the tension in the game. Fingers crossed set pieces like the snow horde, the hotel, the car park all stay in later seasons; we need to be reminded more often that they exist as a threat.
The bigger one is the change to Ellie’s back story; this episode makes pretty clear that Ellie is immune because of the circumstances of her birth and that the cure is almost a sure thing. That weakens firstly the random happenstance of Ellie’s immunity making her more unique - if the Fireflies know this is what happened, would you put it past them letting infected bite pregnant women deliberately to make a ‘cure baby’?
More impactful however is the stripping away of the ambiguity. The reason the game’s ending works is despite Joel making that horrifying choice, the possibility exists that the cure would not have worked. Here, it makes it pretty clear it would have. This means it becomes less of a Sophie’s Choice type deal and more of a selfish act. It’s by far weaker than the game because of the lack of ambiguity, and needs Pascal and Ramsey to sell it heavily.
Part II is far more interesting from a story perspective, but also far choppier and meandering. Really interested to see how they do it.
Haven't watched the episode yet but this seems to cataclysmically break the point of the first game's ending. Fuck me.
By n8 dogg Go To Postif the Fireflies know this is what happened, would you put it past them letting infected bite pregnant women deliberately to make a ‘cure baby’?
Marlene doesn't actually know Ellie is immune until she gets bitten which is essentially right before episode 1, that's why she has her captured and all that. So in that small amount of time yeah, it makes sense to just wait to try and create a cure from Ellie rather than infecting pregnant women.
Also I don't think there's supposed to be much ambiguity around the cure working. None of the characters in the game ever question its success, and I don't think I've heard Druckmann or anyone involved creatively address that. I get why as a viewer people might think that but I don't think it's the point at all.
By Pizza Go To PostMarlene doesn't actually know Ellie is immune until she gets bitten which is essentially right before episode 1, that's why she has her captured and all that. So in that small amount of time yeah, it makes sense to just wait to try and create a cure from Ellie rather than infecting pregnant women.
Also I don't think there's supposed to be much ambiguity around the cure working. None of the characters in the game ever question its success, and I don't think I've heard Druckmann or anyone involved creatively address that. I get why as a viewer people might think that but I don't think it's the point at all.
Doesn’t their journey take several months in the game? I if the fireflies know the conditions in which she developed immunity and are willing to kill a little girl without asking, then it stands to reason they would be out there starting experiments. Wouldn’t make sense to wait months on a slim chance Joel and Ellie didn’t get killed along the way.
Regarding the whole ambiguity or not, it’s not explicit because as you say that’s not the question they want people to answer. Joel doesn’t kill them out of principle, he kills them out of love for Ellie.
By Crusher Go To PostDoesn’t their journey take several months in the game? I if the fireflies know the conditions in which she developed immunity and are willing to kill a little girl without asking, then it stands to reason they would be out there starting experiments. Wouldn’t make sense to wait months on a slim chance Joel and Ellie didn’t get killed along the way.
Sure but there's plenty of ways you can justify it. In the game there's a bunch of notes explaining how the Fireflies barely made it to Salt Lake, a bunch of them died along the way, you could say the same happened here, maybe they were focusing on surviving. Also how many pregnant women along the way would they have access to? Also killing 1 girl = more morally justifiable than killing a pregnant woman and very possibly her infant. Just not some big showbreaking plothole imo