By You got 14 bricks right there? Go To PostI doubt the G-league is as physical as what Victor played against, and we saw what he did against G-league bigs when he dominated the Ignite. For guards g-league/ignite is cool, but for a big like him playing against physical grown men is much better for development. What bigs have come out of the g-league? Most guys struggle cause they suck at team ball coming out of HS.The bigs that would dominate G-League are already on the main roster, tbh. There are fewer good bigs out there so they are less likely to be sent to the G-League and instead stay with the main team and get minutes there.
By Sharp Go To PostI don't think his wingspan is actually 6'9", especially after watching him struggle to get his shot off so much in the G League. He never got measured at the combine and wingspan for prospects is fudged a lot when they know it won't get properly measured (for instance the Thompsons are claimed to have a 7' wingspan despite it measuring at like 6'9" at their actual combine a year ago, I kinda doubt it increased three inches since then considering they're already 20).Cam also has tiny hands.
Cam could be a beast but he has a lot of question marks. Historically bad assist rate for a good player in the NBA, extremely slow release, not a good free throw shooter despite being okay at threes this season. And he's apparently dropping after his workouts too which is rarely a good sign (though that could be a lie). I like him around the Wizards' range, or even a little earlier, but no way I would take him top three.
By You got 14 bricks right there? Go To PostYou think they want Scoot that badly to do it?If they can get Scoot, Sharpe, Simons, and like 3+ unprotected picks, yeah.
By knux-future Go To Postwho is the annual MCW oh lord I hope my team doesn't draft him guy?I don't think there is anyone like that in this lottery class. At least, not known ahead of time. Everyone outside of Wemby has at least one fatal flaw that no one knows if they can work around to become successful.
By Kibner Go To PostCam also has tiny hands.Yeah I saw that... I'm not sure how to interpret that though, since I've never actually seen any rigorous study of whether it's genuinely bad to have small hands, and if so how much it matters. e.g. one theory is that it helps with steals, but he already had a really good steal rate. Good rebounder too. I also saw some people saying they thought good touch was associated with small hands (I think KD has notoriously small hands for his size?) so it might kind of cancel out.
By Sharp Go To PostYeah I saw that… I'm not sure how to interpret that though, since I've never actually seen any rigorous study of whether it's genuinely bad to have small hands, and if so how much it matters. e.g. one theory is that it helps with steals, but he already had a really good steal rate. I also saw some people saying they thought good touch was associated with small hands (I think KD has notoriously small hands for his size?) so it might kind of cancel out.Nah, small hands mostly just affects how well the player can grip the ball. Small hands hurts catching passes and also handling ability (at #1 playmaker level). If you have monster hands, it lets you just wave the ball around and throw ridiculous 1-handed passes and also use illegal-but-never-called ballhandling techniques. It can also affect grip strength so small hands would be more likely to have rebounds taken from them.
tldr; having hands that are unable to strongly palm the ball put a serious cap on superstar possibility
By Kibner Go To PostNah, small hands mostly just affects how well the player can grip the ball. Small hands hurts catching passes and also handling ability (at #1 playmaker level). If you have monster hands, it lets you just wave the ball around and throw ridiculous 1-handed passes and also use illegal-but-never-called ballhandling techniques. It can also affect grip strength so small hands would be more likely to have rebounds taken from them.Maybe. I'm torn with him though because he does so many things well (including stuff like rebound well which is supposed to be hard for small handed guys)... he basically plays like an athletic beast with good touch, kind of Zion very lite. He's a really interesting flawed prospect. I actually think he and Amen are kind of similar in that regard (superstar potential with severe and obvious flaws). It's why I hope he falls to the Wizards. That said, I was kind of expecting him to kill in the workouts and it sounds like he isn't...
tldr; having hands that are unable to strongly palm the ball put a serious cap on superstar possibility
By Sharp Go To PostMaybe. I'm torn with him though because he does so many things well (including stuff like rebound well which is supposed to be hard for small handed guys)… he basically plays like an athletic beast with good touch, kind of Zion very lite. He's a really interesting flawed prospect. I actually think he and Amen are kind of similar in that regard (superstar potential with severe and obvious flaws). It's why I hope he falls to the Wizards.The most damning thing about Cam is that he plays as if his teammates don't exist. Whiteside level passing vision.
By Kibner Go To PostThe most damning thing about Cam is that he plays as if his teammates don't exist. Whiteside level passing vision.Yeah that's the incredibly severe flaw, lol. But some team is going to think they can teach him how to process, and if they're right they just got a superstar at way below superstar draft position. It's hard for me to really dream on most of the other prospects around that range.
Whitmore's upside was shown in the U19 games where he was almost the teams best player, no? Nova was buns this year from a talent standpoint
By knux-future Go To PostWhitmore's upside was shown in the U19 games where he was almost the teams best player, no? Nova was buns this year from a talent standpointHe was a beast against the actual competition he played, I think he ranked like #3 in Pelton's stats only model which is really impressive. I think the concern is that his play is too dependent on being able to bully everyone at the rim and the stats won't translate against NBA competition, since he's not actually Zion. If he can't get to the rim every time he catches the ball then he has to learn to pass, basically.
By Sharp Go To PostYeah that's the incredibly severe flaw, lol. But some team is going to think they can teach him how to process, and if they're right they just got a superstar at way below superstar draft position. It's hard for me to really dream on most of the other prospects around that range.I don't think he really has superstar potential, because of the tiny hands (similar sized as Cam Johnson, apparently) and passing. lol
I just don't think he will be able to run a good offense. Still worth a lottery pick, I just think he tops out at, like 2x All-Star or something and never sniffs an All NBA team.
By Kibner Go To PostI don't think he really has superstar potential, because of the tiny hands (similar sized as Cam Johnson, apparently) and passing. lolI mean, you could be right. Personally, I really don't care that much about the hands because I doubt they're as predictive as you're implying. Jimmy Butler barely has a positive wingspan and he has one of the best steal rates in the league, good measurements help but they aren't everything. OTOH I think the odds of him learning how to pass are pretty low, but if he doesn't and still becomes a 2x All-Star that's not terrible value for the #8 pick...
I just don't think he will be able to run a good offense. Still worth a lottery pick, I just think he tops out at, like 2x All-Star or something and never sniffs an All NBA team.
By diehard Go To Postim glad yall are analyzing these players so you can tell me how we screwed up on Thursdaylong days ahead comrade
By Sharp Go To PostHe was a beast against the actual competition he played, I think he ranked like #3 in Pelton's stats only model which is really impressive. I think the concern is that his play is too dependent on being able to bully everyone at the rim and the stats won't translate against NBA competition, since he's not actually Zion. If he can't get to the rim every time he catches the ball then he has to learn to pass, basically.
I just look at him compared to Miller and think there's a much higher ceiling, which is what I'd be looking for at #3 assuming the Hornets don't fuck around and find out. I can't fathom Miller ever being the top guy with his athleticism, and I think a good coach could fix a lot of Whitmore's issues, that's all. Plus he's younger.
On the other hand everything about him screams Corey Maggette which should be a red flag.
By Sharp Go To PostHe actually came out of Wemby's league originally.Didn't help him from getting sent down.
If he struggles to score someone else will get it… AD lost ROTY by a landslide even though he played about 65 games that season. The voters don't always choose the best rookie, but it's not just a preseason hype award either. I just don't think Scoot will be in the right role to put up big numbers next year. If the lottery turned out differently and he were going to the Spurs he'd be a decent bet IMO.
AD wasn't nearly as hyped as Wemby.
By blackace Go To PostDidn't help him from getting sent down.I mean, you can use that argument for every player since LeBron. AD is probably the most hyped player since LeBron who actually played his true rookie season, and he didn't win ROTY. Zion barely played and obviously didn't win. LeBron won, but he deserved to win. I don't think there's an example of someone winning just off preseason hype that I can remember.
AD wasn't nearly as hyped as Wemby.
By Sharp Go To PostI mean, you can use that argument for every player since LeBron. AD is probably the most hyped player since LeBron who actually played his true rookie season, and he didn't win ROTY. Zion barely played and obviously didn't win. LeBron won, but he deserved to win. I don't think there's an example of someone winning just off preseason hype that I can remember.that's debatable. At the best they should have Kidd/Hill the award.
I don't know would go as far as to say Melo got robbed, but he probably should have won.
jfc the shots on these Thompson lads. Other than Amen is a physical freak I'm not sure what you can take away from their games as they barely resemble actual basketball
By pilonv1 Go To Postjfc the shots on these Thompson lads. Other than Amen is a physical freak I'm not sure what you can take away from their games as they barely resemble actual basketballCam Boozer (a real top prospect) came into that league at 15 years old this year for a few exhibition games and made Amen and Ausar's stats look extremely pedestrian despite them being 20 and the league being mostly high schoolers, lol. we just don't know how big the gap is since they basically made themselves impossible to scout. IMO, the athleticism is real but the "best playmaker in the draft!" stuff is just wishful thinking, and yeah their jumpshots are unbelievably broken.
By Sharp Go To PostIMO, the athleticism is real but the "best playmaker in the draft!" stuff is just wishful thinking, and yeah their jumpshots are unbelievably broken.
A lot of that playmaking is just because the players they're defending have no idea where to be. They're scoring about 1/3 or more of their points in transition.
There's one clip in the Ausar Thompson package where he gets ball up at half court, and all five opposing defenders are inside the three point line but no one even gets close to him and he just strides in for a dunk. The sort of shit I'd see in my rec league.
edit: and they're both fucking 20 years old. What if this is close to the ceiling?
By DY_nasty Go To PostAll I see now when I look at Miller is Trevor ArizaAriza had a super high motor his early years
By Sharp Go To PostCam Boozer (a real top prospect) came into that league at 15 years old this year for a few exhibition games and made Amen and Ausar's stats look extremely pedestrian despite them being 20 and the league being mostly high schoolers, lol. we just don't know how big the gap is since they basically made themselves impossible to scout. IMO, the athleticism is real but the "best playmaker in the draft!" stuff is just wishful thinking, and yeah their jumpshots are unbelievably broken.Cam is a beast tho... another twin too. 6'9 at 15 son of an NBA All-Star he better be showing people up
FWIW I think Ainge does know what he's doing, just took a look at a bunch of statistical draft projection models and Anthony Black is almost always top 5 and sometimes top 2... if you think you're actually getting the second best pick in the draft moving the two Jazz picks would be a no brainer.
By Sharp Go To PostFWIW I think Ainge does know what he's doing, just took a look at a bunch of statistical draft projection models and Anthony Black is almost always top 5 and sometimes top 2… if you think you're actually getting the second best pick in the draft moving the two Jazz picks would be a no brainer.
Ainge probably hopes Whitmore drops to him. He loves the 6'6" wing that's an athlete.
By blackace Go To PostCam is a beast tho… another twin too. 6'9 at 15 son of an NBA All-Star he better be showing people upYeah he's a beast... but he's 15 and dominating competition that Amen and Ausar can't at 20.
Like, I know why they're going to go high. It's because of shit like this.
But why are guys who can do that hiding out in a fake league and getting outperformed by 15 year olds if they're supposedly so good at every aspect of basketball outside of shooting? It doesn't make sense to me. I feel like people are just seeing clips like that and falling in love and justifying it afterwards by claiming they have this amazing skillset that they actually don't.
By You got 14 bricks right there? Go To PostSomeone in memphis was talking about cause how his contract is the only way he is back in Denver is if he purposely takes less money since Denver can’t offer him the mle
By Dark PhaZe Go To PostUm….how is this the first time I've heard about OTE"Anthony Black can't shoot!" doesn't hit as hard when you realize none of these guys can shoot lol.
wtf is this shit
By jjasper Go To PostSomeone in memphis was talking about cause how his contract is the only way he is back in Denver is if he purposely takes less money since Denver can’t offer him the mle
By reilo Go To PostSo basically he can do a 1+1 and then extend and basically lose about 4 million this year and be ok the rest
By Sharp Go To Post"Anthony Black can't shoot!" doesn't hit as hard when you realize none of these guys can shoot lol.
Just give me Gradey Dick
6'8 shooter with a step back and a first step, I'll take it.
Hawks play below their talent level. I'd wait to see what Quinn can do with a full year with them before doing anything too drastic. Or at least until the deadline.
By domino Go To PostNaw trade traetrae is good, unless they plan to rebuild?