By Smokey Go To PostI have the Senn 363D and then some regular Logitech speakers. I've actually wanted to upgrade those for a while too.Got a crab boil and band practice coming up in a few minutes, so I can hopefully respond more in-depth later.
I'm not sure if that sound card would really need replacement. If so, you might be better off with getting one of the USB DACs with either an integrated or separate amp, depending on how far you want to go.
Are you using stereo speakers or surround speakers? If you want to change out your speakers for something else, it would be a good idea to hold off on picking an amp until you decide what speakers you get. You want to be able to match them and not damage them, afterall!
By Kibner Go To PostGot a crab boil and band practice coming up in a few minutes, so I can hopefully respond more in-depth later.
I'm not sure if that sound card would really need replacement. If so, you might be better off with getting one of the USB DACs with either an integrated or separate amp, depending on how far you want to go.
Are you using stereo speakers or surround speakers? If you want to change out your speakers for something else, it would be a good idea to hold off on picking an amp until you decide what speakers you get. You want to be able to match them and not damage them, afterall!
You may be right. I've been fine this long with it. Regarding the speakers I'm using stereo. I don't pay attention to audio too much, so I'm not sure what a good amp would be or a good set of speakers to go with them. Counting on you to kind of feel me in there!
In other news, MSI revealed the 1080Ti Lighting Z and it looks like a beast
The 580 Lightning Extreme was the first GPU I used when I got into building back in 2011. Eventually got two of them. Enjoyed them, and sold one to Kabro! I've been thinking of dumping my FE for an AIB model with the Strix model leading the way, followed by the FTW3. 1080ti FE cards on Ebay look to be going for around the $700 range. May see what this has to offer though, it looks to have 3 PCIe 8x Pin connectors.
Full Review - http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/msi-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-lightning-z-review,1.html
Price - $750
You gonna need to give me a budget or a goal or preferences for sound quality. Lol
Personally, I like equipment that focuses on being tight and clean in all registers, especially bass. I don't need a booming bass, but I do like being able to feel it. I listen to a good bit of classical and live music so being able to hear all the different registers clearly without any muddling is important to me.
I have a pair of powered speakers that were about $300 and a sound card that also has a headphone amp that was about $200. I'm thinking of adding a sub, but the only ones I have been able to find that meet my tight, crisp requirement are like $550 so I'm still undecided.
I could also get a DAC that does DSP work and has one of the best room correction and eq software (Dirac Live) but that is another $500.
E: I also sit close to my speakers ( less than 3 ft) so I don't need them to play loud or anything
Personally, I like equipment that focuses on being tight and clean in all registers, especially bass. I don't need a booming bass, but I do like being able to feel it. I listen to a good bit of classical and live music so being able to hear all the different registers clearly without any muddling is important to me.
I have a pair of powered speakers that were about $300 and a sound card that also has a headphone amp that was about $200. I'm thinking of adding a sub, but the only ones I have been able to find that meet my tight, crisp requirement are like $550 so I'm still undecided.
I could also get a DAC that does DSP work and has one of the best room correction and eq software (Dirac Live) but that is another $500.
E: I also sit close to my speakers ( less than 3 ft) so I don't need them to play loud or anything
But, yeah, give me a budget, things you like or often listen to, and any other requirements or preferences.
Intel takes 10.4% CPU share from Intel in Q2 2017
http://wccftech.com/amd-takes-10-4-cpu-share-intel-q2-2017-largest-single-quarter-share-gain-history/
Wow
No wonder X299 was rushed
http://wccftech.com/amd-takes-10-4-cpu-share-intel-q2-2017-largest-single-quarter-share-gain-history/
Ryzen May Be The Most Successful Product Launch In AMD’s History
AMD now commands 31% of the market, which constitutes the largest CPU share level the company has reached in a decade. Only a quarter back the company was sitting at 20.6%. A 10%+ share gain in a single quarter is unheard of in the x86 CPU market and truly reflects the magnitude of this achievement for AMD.
In Q1 2017 the company had only gained 2.2% in the same market, largely due to the fact that only half of AMD’s desktop Ryzen SKUs had been available in the market and only in the last month of the quarter. The initial launch was also hamstrung by a shortage of AM4 motherboards. The second quarter however was dramatically different. Today, AM4 motherboards are consistently in-stock and there are more than twice as many Ryzen processors to choose from.
Wow
No wonder X299 was rushed
Smokey, if you are looking for some quality desktop powered speakers that don't break the bank, I can easily recommend these through first-hand experience: https://www.amazon.com/Swans-Bookshelf-room-filling-Excellent-Dissipation/dp/B006D9Y8TQ?th=1
There might be a better speaker in that price range, but I can't find it. If you want deep bass, you will need to buy a subwoofer and maybe something that can set a crossover for you.
There might be a better speaker in that price range, but I can't find it. If you want deep bass, you will need to buy a subwoofer and maybe something that can set a crossover for you.
I have heard good things about Edifier speakers, too: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B016PATXSI/ref=psdc_3236451011_t2_B006D9Y8TQ
Schiit Modi Multibit is en route. In the end we decided we wanted a multibit DAC and that made the choice pretty easy.
What makes it special/different? I'm still pretty new to that stuff and it hadn't really come up other than Schiit being a trusted brand.
Schiit is the actual name? Haha
And yea I'd like to learn more about the minutiae of why you picked that one!
And yea I'd like to learn more about the minutiae of why you picked that one!
Let me preface this by saying that I believe many of the things said & written about DACs, particularly modern day ones, fall into the placebophile category. I think the (pre)amp and speakers make a much bigger difference when it comes to sound definition & general character. That being said, my brother wanted something other than your typical 100-150$ DAC, and multibit DACs are the new(-ish) hotness, so we went with the cheapest multibit from Schiit (or anyone else, really). Which is basically a trickle-down version of their costlier DACs, Bifrost and Gungnir. Costs 250$/300€.
As for what it does different / better*...
The multibit part, coupled with Schiit's custom digital filter (which I suspect is the main culprit), is supposed to make this DAC sound more, well, warm & analog, to use two not-at-all overused adjectives. We'll see how it plays with by bro's Focals, which can sound a bit too bright & clinical.
*debatable
As for what it does different / better*...
Simplifying, multibit DACs preserve the original samples.
Our music is encoded using pulse-code modulation (PCM), which represents audio as samples of the signal amplitude. However, the vast majority of DACs these days actually perform their decoding using a pulse-density modulation (PDM) signal, using a technique called delta-sigma modulation. These kinds of DACs are commonly referred to simply as "delta-sigma" to differentiate from multibit.
The supposed problem is that delta-sigma DACs, in order to do their decoding, much discard the original PCM samples when they convert to PDM. Further, delta-sigma DACs are typically 1-5 bits, making up for the lost dynamic range with extremely high oversampling - e.g. in the MHz range.
Multibit solutions overcome these supposed drawbacks by decoding the audio signal with a true 16+ bit DAC, preserving the original PCM samples.
On top of this, Schiit has layered a proprietary closed-form, frequency- and time-domain optimized digital filter. Digital filters are necessary to perform upsampling of the audio signal, which moves aliasing distortion out of the audible band. Some typical methods for this are the minimum-phase and linear-phase filters. Some people claim that minimum phase filters are better because they avoid pre-ringing, while other prefer linear phase because they avoid phase-distortion. I'm not sure how Schiit's closed-form filter differs from linear-phase, other than it is supposed to preserve all of the original samples.
Whether or not any of this is audible is up to the listener, I guess. I haven't heard a multibit DAC, although I'd like to. More than one person has claimed not to have heard a difference between the Schiit Bifrost multibit and other DACs, like the ODAC, in blind AB/X testing.
The multibit part, coupled with Schiit's custom digital filter (which I suspect is the main culprit), is supposed to make this DAC sound more, well, warm & analog, to use two not-at-all overused adjectives. We'll see how it plays with by bro's Focals, which can sound a bit too bright & clinical.
*debatable
I agree with your reasoning. :)
When I have been looking, I am mostly just trying to make sure that interference is minimized throughout the hardware and the processor is fast enough to not cause significant delay when doing its thing.
When I have been looking, I am mostly just trying to make sure that interference is minimized throughout the hardware and the processor is fast enough to not cause significant delay when doing its thing.
Yeah, that sounds about right.
You want a quality DAC and amp, in general, if audio is important to you. Quality, in this case, means something by a reputable company that is known to not cheap out on unreliable parts or poor assembly or something. They make things that work, are reliable, and have minimal signal interference.
When looking for a specific DAC, the only other major consideration is making sure it has all the inputs/outputs you need for your setup.
Amps are a bit more complicated. You want to make sure they are powerful enough to drive your headphones/speakers but aren't too strong at the same time. Continuous power (at the relevant ohm rating for your device) is the amplifier stat you want to look at and compare to your speaker/headphone power rating range.
In the case of speakers, there are calculators out there that can help you figure out how powerful of an amp you need to play your speakers at a certain volume for a certain distance. This is helpful in getting one suited to your purposes, especially when the speaker might have a large power rating range (20-200 W, for example).
Important safety note: Powered/active speakers have an amp built into them already so using another amp on them can lead to damage. So don't do it. :p
When properly paired to a sound system, amps won't have much difference in sound quality between them but they can color the output sound ("warm" vs "bright" vs other preferences). The sound differences between "neutral" amps shouldn't be noticeable to most people.
Well-made/designed DACs just don't have much difference in sound quality between them. They mostly use the same algorithms but resolve at different resolutions, iirc. Quality ones are usually at the "good enough for human hearing" point.
In general, you get a much much much higher return on sound quality by investing in the actual speakers/headphones than in ever higher priced DACs and amps. Getting a quality DAC and amp are still worth it if you care about sound, though. And you can get integrated ones that have both and are good enough for most headphones while not being too expensive ($100 or less). Speaker amps can get a bit more expensive since they require more power.
You want a quality DAC and amp, in general, if audio is important to you. Quality, in this case, means something by a reputable company that is known to not cheap out on unreliable parts or poor assembly or something. They make things that work, are reliable, and have minimal signal interference.
When looking for a specific DAC, the only other major consideration is making sure it has all the inputs/outputs you need for your setup.
Amps are a bit more complicated. You want to make sure they are powerful enough to drive your headphones/speakers but aren't too strong at the same time. Continuous power (at the relevant ohm rating for your device) is the amplifier stat you want to look at and compare to your speaker/headphone power rating range.
In the case of speakers, there are calculators out there that can help you figure out how powerful of an amp you need to play your speakers at a certain volume for a certain distance. This is helpful in getting one suited to your purposes, especially when the speaker might have a large power rating range (20-200 W, for example).
Important safety note: Powered/active speakers have an amp built into them already so using another amp on them can lead to damage. So don't do it. :p
When properly paired to a sound system, amps won't have much difference in sound quality between them but they can color the output sound ("warm" vs "bright" vs other preferences). The sound differences between "neutral" amps shouldn't be noticeable to most people.
Well-made/designed DACs just don't have much difference in sound quality between them. They mostly use the same algorithms but resolve at different resolutions, iirc. Quality ones are usually at the "good enough for human hearing" point.
In general, you get a much much much higher return on sound quality by investing in the actual speakers/headphones than in ever higher priced DACs and amps. Getting a quality DAC and amp are still worth it if you care about sound, though. And you can get integrated ones that have both and are good enough for most headphones while not being too expensive ($100 or less). Speaker amps can get a bit more expensive since they require more power.
A small addendum to my previous post about DACs and amps. There is also something called a DSP (digital signal processor). It is often used by room correction software to tune your speakers to account for your listening area and the speakers' own sound characteristics.
The software does this by using a mic to record how the speakers sound at a bunch of points around your listening area and then creating some digital filters based on the results. After this calibration, any sound the DSP receives is then changed by these filters before being played back. The DSP has a relatively beefy CPU to handle the processing of these filters. Between that and the software for the calibration process that creates the custom filters using their own proprietary algorithms, the price can get pretty up there.
The AVR in my 2.1 home theater system uses one and the room correction has made a big difference in sound quality to my ears. Especially in the lower register (which is where this tech is most helpful, generally). The sub is integrated much more smoothly into the overall sound than it was when I was just setting crossovers and manual distances. I have been looking into spending relatively big money on a DAC+DSP specifically for the DSP part and the Dirac room correction software since the software my AVR uses is on the very low end (Audyssey's lowest tier, Bronze) and Dirac is among the best.
The software does this by using a mic to record how the speakers sound at a bunch of points around your listening area and then creating some digital filters based on the results. After this calibration, any sound the DSP receives is then changed by these filters before being played back. The DSP has a relatively beefy CPU to handle the processing of these filters. Between that and the software for the calibration process that creates the custom filters using their own proprietary algorithms, the price can get pretty up there.
The AVR in my 2.1 home theater system uses one and the room correction has made a big difference in sound quality to my ears. Especially in the lower register (which is where this tech is most helpful, generally). The sub is integrated much more smoothly into the overall sound than it was when I was just setting crossovers and manual distances. I have been looking into spending relatively big money on a DAC+DSP specifically for the DSP part and the Dirac room correction software since the software my AVR uses is on the very low end (Audyssey's lowest tier, Bronze) and Dirac is among the best.
Oh yeah, some crazy shit that I'm kinda sorta interested in is using one of these DSPs for my car's audio. I don't know how exactly it would integrate into my sound system, but it is a popularly advertised use of the tech.
DSPs are for posers. Real men treat their rooms. Even realer man get down to business and make their own acoustic panels, traps & shit.
http://slaent.com/thread/624310/page/1/post/629579/
I'll be curious to hear about the results, if you ever get through with your purchase, Kib.
http://slaent.com/thread/624310/page/1/post/629579/
I'll be curious to hear about the results, if you ever get through with your purchase, Kib.
Haha. If I had a dedicated listening/viewing room, I would definitely treat it. As is, there is nothing separating my living room, kitchen, dining room, and foyer/computer area. And there are windows galore, including an eight-foot wide sliding glass door along one of the sides. Walls are vinyl siding -> wood -> fake wood paneling -> dry wall. Not exactly acoustically sound. lol
With that said, I'm totally jealous of your panels. That's a good album cover liner.
With that said, I'm totally jealous of your panels. That's a good album cover liner.
Wanting those new max q Nvidia laptops hard right now. Going out of state for two weeks for work and could really use a capable PC gaming box during that time in fuking Wisconsin
the software out right now is too meh visually to compel me to upgrade the computer right now
waiting for a big visual leap to get hype
waiting for a big visual leap to get hype
By diehard Go To Postthe days of Far Cry/Crysis esque visual leaps are over.This.
Doing my sister's build is bringing me to the reality of my build next year. Unlike her, I know exactly what I want and need: a legit gaming computer with a fuckton of memory, SSD/HD storage (at least 275 GB SSD, 8 TB HDD and maybe a secondary HDD), and probably a 1080 since 1070s gotta age a bit by then. Luckily that build won't start anytime soon.
Smokey, did you take a look at those speakers I suggested or have any answers to my questions on your requirements / preferences? Those speakers I linked aren't super cheap ($180, iirc), but they are good enough for 99% of people.
By diehard Go To Postthe days of Far Cry/Crysis esque visual leaps are over.
nah, we'll see more leaps--suspecting the next one will be cyberpunk
Kibner, I just watched a 20min video about EQing with the MiniDSP. Great stuff. If my breh will feel up to it, we might eventually go all out with room treatment + DSP.
Also, the Schiit arrived today.
Also, the Schiit arrived today.
By Dark PhaZe Go To Postnah, we'll see more leaps–suspecting the next one will be cyberpunk"Coming to CD-ROM, PS4 and Xbox One."
By Zabojnik Go To PostKibner, I just watched a 20min video about EQing with the MiniDSP. Great stuff. If my breh will feel up to it, we might eventually go all out with room treatment + DSP.Excellent. I'm dig into it more soon to see how it handles integrating a subwoofer into the setup. Does it provide crossover management? Does the room correction help integrating the subwoofer to the stereo speakers? Things like that.
Also, the Schiit arrived today.
Oh, hey, it looks like the DDRC-24 does support bass management and integration with the room correction software. https://www.minidsp.com/applications/digital-room-correction/ddrc-24-for-2-1-system
Yay!
Yay!
By Kibner Go To PostExcellent. I'm dig into it more soon to see how it handles integrating a subwoofer into the setup. Does it provide crossover management? Does the room correction help integrating the subwoofer to the stereo speakers? Things like that.The guy was using the 2x4 (maybe it was the 2x4 HD, idk) in the video and went over calibrating a sub as well. So yeah.
I still think room treatment should take precendence. DSP can definitely help, but far as I know it's best used for fine tuning. To get those last 5-10%.
You probably right. I just remember noticing a large difference in balance and transition between my sub and mains when I did it with my existing setup. I didn't really notice much, if any, difference in the mids or highs.
Wife surprised me and got one of those chairs you see streamers use, Vertagear SL2000. Put it together. I don't hate it .
Replaces a pretty terrible chair I've been using for years that I got for free.
Her words were "I thought it would be better than what you have and look nice when you put together your water cooling setup"
Replaces a pretty terrible chair I've been using for years that I got for free.
Her words were "I thought it would be better than what you have and look nice when you put together your water cooling setup"
By Kibner Go To PostA good wife.
If the chair doesn't come with lumbar support, get some.
It comes with a lumbar support cushion and a head cushion. Can lean back pretty far too and the leather feels pretty good.
By Smokey Go To PostIt comes with a lumbar support cushion and a head cushion. Can lean back pretty far too and the leather feels pretty good.Nice. Most of those gaming chairs are part recliner, too, so you can really kick back in them.
By Kibner Go To PostSmokey, did you take a look at those speakers I suggested or have any answers to my questions on your requirements / preferences? Those speakers I linked aren't super cheap ($180, iirc), but they are good enough for 99% of people.
I did look at them, and those are kind of what I'm looking for (that style). I've never really taken audio seriously in the living room or PC, which is weird because I listen to music quite a bit and can really appreciate great sound.
Chair is great. Played a few hours of PUBG and no fatigue or soreness in my back at all, and posture is much improved.
I've thought about one just because I have yet to find an office chair that's comfortable but I don't know.
And returning to Forza Horizon 3 has really highlighted how shitty old and small my monitor is and that I really need a new one.
And returning to Forza Horizon 3 has really highlighted how shitty old and small my monitor is and that I really need a new one.
DIEHARD
how you liking that Ti FTW3? I'm looking at the FTW3, Strix, and MSI Lightning if I decide to sell my FE Ti. Just started reading up on the icX tech in EVGAs new cards. Fan and temperature control for the GPU, Power, and Memory is appealing to the GPU info side of me. In practice how good is the new cooler and is it quiet?
how you liking that Ti FTW3? I'm looking at the FTW3, Strix, and MSI Lightning if I decide to sell my FE Ti. Just started reading up on the icX tech in EVGAs new cards. Fan and temperature control for the GPU, Power, and Memory is appealing to the GPU info side of me. In practice how good is the new cooler and is it quiet?
By Smokey Go To PostDIEHARDI actually really wanted the FTW3 but i got impatient and got the Strix. It's quieter than my H110i GTX AIO under full load and runs at like 2020mhz on boost.
how you liking that Ti FTW3? I'm looking at the FTW3, Strix, and MSI Lightning if I decide to sell my FE Ti. Just started reading up on the icX tech in EVGAs new cards. Fan and temperature control for the GPU, Power, and Memory is appealing to the GPU info side of me. In practice how good is the new cooler and is it quiet?
I think the Lightning Z is the new hot shit though...
As expected, buying a 21:9 monitor is turning out to be one of the best PC / gaming related decisions I've ever made.
I pity the 16:9 fool(s).
I pity the 16:9 fool(s).
So, I have one more question, before I head to microcenter later on this week. They seem to have some decent deals on the Rizen 7 1700. What mobo would you all suggest? I'm not overclocking, but will be adding ram later on.
I appreciate all of the help, by the way.
I appreciate all of the help, by the way.
Yeah, we're gonna need a budget and feature preferences (how many USB 3.1, SATA & M.2 ports you need, etc.).
Even if you're not overclocking, I'd stay away from A320 motherboards. If you're budget constricted, you'll likely want to go with a B350 or a "basic" X370 mobo like the Asus Prime X370 Pro (~140$).
Even if you're not overclocking, I'd stay away from A320 motherboards. If you're budget constricted, you'll likely want to go with a B350 or a "basic" X370 mobo like the Asus Prime X370 Pro (~140$).