By Fenderputty Go To PostI can get all sorts of problems sitting at my desk at work. Should I consider that a sport now too? Golf is infinitely more athletic that gaming. Jesus Christ.
Going full absurdity hurts your point. "I can die driving a car on the road, am I an F1 driver now?"
By shun Go To PostIs break dance consider sport, some do it is also an art. At the end of the day a sport is a competition so it doesn't really matter.I'd say that as we accept figure skating/dressage as sports, you'd have to accept break dancing. I know there are competitions for it, though that is about where my knowledge ends on the matter.
What matters is the spirit of competition and how fun and heated it can be when people compete.
I feel the whole video game sports debate is just one of those things that gets lost in the generation gap. Similar to how popular and influential people like Pewdiepie can be on portals like youtube, while older people have either never heard of him or discredit his content.
Older people who don't understand it won't ever accept it, but eventually they'll die out and be replaced by a generation that won't even question it.
Older people who don't understand it won't ever accept it, but eventually they'll die out and be replaced by a generation that won't even question it.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostYou have been making hilarious statements about golf up to and including vacuous crap about how it's just walking on a field and gamers sustain worse injuries. I'm kind of done here, this is brainless prattle.It was dumbed down/debased to the level that people were trying to lower the conversation about games.
I never said gamers sustain worse injuries. Just that they also suffer injuries related to their sport.
By Retro Go To PostRight, but that argument was made challenging the claim that video games can't be sports.
What I'm trying to point out is that it doesn't make sense to argue that golf is a sport, on the terms you've presented, while also maintaining the position that video games are not a sport.
Others got it. And that's the the sum of it.
By giririsss Go To PostThey all require large amounts of training and skill and take place inside competitive environments with very specifics rules of engagement.
So does chess. So does tournament poker. Which is why I think your definition is lacking. There's a clear athletic component to sports. it's why I have a hard time considering shooting a sport. Which also requires more athleticism than gaming.
By giririsss Go To PostGoing full absurdity hurts your point. "I can die driving a car on the road, am I an F1 driver now?"I'd say that as we accept figure skating/dressage as sports, you'd have to accept break dancing. I know there are competitions for it, though that is about where my knowledge ends on the matter.
I wasn't the one arguing that possible injuries sustained during an activity makes something a sport.
By Retro Go To PostI feel the whole video game sports debate is just one of those things that gets lost in the generation gap. Similar to how popular and influential people like Pewdiepie can be on portals like youtube, while older people have either never heard of him or discredit his content.Don't think age is the issue here.
Older people who don't understand it won't ever accept it, but eventually they'll die out and be replaced by a generation that won't even question it.
By Retro Go To PostI feel the whole video game sports debate is just one of those things that gets lost in the generation gap. Similar to how popular and influential people like Pewdiepie can be on portals like youtube, while older people have either never heard of him or discredit his content.I don't argue its watchability or marketability
Older people who don't understand it won't ever accept it, but eventually they'll die out and be replaced by a generation that won't even question it.
i just think its not a sport lol
if poker isn't, then games aren't - and as long as its called esports, then you'll get this same argument over and over instead of people actually talking about what's going on ie - http://espn.go.com/esports/
guys get hurt because those controllers aren't designed for 1000s of hours of play. you can play chess without working arms. games are just a flimsy barrier away from that
By Retro Go To PostI feel the whole video game sports debate is just one of those things that gets lost in the generation gap. Similar to how popular and influential people like Pewdiepie can be on portals like youtube, while older people have never heard of him or discredit his content.It's certainly challenges a lot of pre-conceived notions about what you want to accept as a sport. And who can be sports stars.
Older people who don't understand it won't ever accept it, but eventually they'll die out and be replaced by a generation that won't even question it.
And then there is a generational thing. And a social thing too. Large chunks of my friends all follow competitive gaming. Whether it's CS, LoL or DOTA. And societal in general. It's just accepted more in some countries than it is in others.
But I can't have a conversation about it with my father the way I can rugby, league, cricket, any other traditional sport. (Though several of my cousins I can).
I could imagine tuning into a Rocket League competition if I'm sitting around bored.
Tried following a streamed DotA 2 match and it was confusing as hell.
Tried following a streamed DotA 2 match and it was confusing as hell.
Like, why do we call performance cars "sporty"?
It's not like this is a sacred word not to be used in vain or anything.
It's not like this is a sacred word not to be used in vain or anything.
By Fenderputty Go To PostSo does chess. So does tournament poker. Which is why I think your definition is lacking. There's a clear athletic component to sports. it's why I have a hard time considering shooting a sport. Which also requires more athleticism than gaming.
Isn't poker considered a sport? I wouldn't be surprised if it was. I know chess is. That sentence isn't my definition. And before you ask, I don't know what I would consider it to be. But those are things that contribute that make me consider those things sports.
Athleticism has been dis-associated as the defining factor of a sport, for a long time.
I wasn't the one arguing that possible injuries sustained during an activity makes something a sport.Nor was I.
Guys get injuries that any one of us can get because we're nerds on computers and game.
Video gaming is something that can be entertaining and has competitive elements. Does a disservice to its own immersion by trying to market itself as another traditional sport. That's actually what I've been getting at. Got sidetracked by hilarious posting about the athleticism that's apparently absent in golf/bowling.
Video gaming is something that can be entertaining and has competitive elements. Does a disservice to its own immersion by trying to market itself as another traditional sport. That's actually what I've been getting at. Got sidetracked by hilarious posting about the athleticism that's apparently absent in golf/bowling.
By giririsss Go To PostIsn't poker considered a sport? I wouldn't be surprised if it was. I know chess is. That sentence isn't my definition. And before you ask, I don't know what I would consider it to be. But those are things that contribute that make me consider those things sports.Athleticism and physical involvement aren't the same thing.
Athleticism has been dis-associated as the defining factor of a sport, for a long time.
Nor was I.
Fishing is more of a sport.
By HasphatsAnts Go To PostLike, why do we call performance cars "sporty"?
It's not like this is a sacred word not to be used in vain or anything.
You see old sport, the word "sport" has various meanings. Some of those being nouns, the use above is an adjective and others verbs. The noun "sport" is defined as a physical activity with rules to compete.
Arguing semantics is fun :P
By DY_nasty Go To PostAthleticism and physical involvement aren't the same thing.
Fishing is more of a sport.
Right. When E-sports starts utilizing VR I'll change my stance on the issue. lol
By blackace Go To PostCurling is a sport
Vigorous sweeping is more physically active than gaming.
By Fenderputty Go To PostYou see old sport, the word "sport" has various meanings. Some of those being nouns, the use above is an adjective and others verbs. The noun "sport" is defined as a physical activity with rules to compete.
Arguing semantics is fun :P
Right. When E-sports starts utilizing VR I'll change my stance on the issue. lol
Well if we're going there, Sport can also encompass things you do to amuse yourself. Like, "I consider it a great sport to annoy my girlfriend with horrible puns."
There's no way you can enjoy watching CS:GO if you don't play the game. Just no point. It's not Quake Arena.
By Gabyskra Go To PostThere's no way you can enjoy watching CS:GO if you don't play the game. Just no point. It's not Quake Arena.I always much preferred Quake to CS. And always found the 1v1 duel tournaments more intense/interesting.
But CS got more popular.
By DY_nasty Go To PostI don't argue its watchability or marketability
i just think its not a sport lol
Right. and I'm saying that most people's definition and idea of a sport is pretty arbitrary and most likely influenced by your experiences growing up. (Like everything)
I mean even in this thread we've had multiple people independently suggest that bowling and golf weren't sports, or at least lesser sports. While having others argue the contrary.
There's really no objective reason why sports and games can't be lumped together, or even a substantial one in my mind. People just have their minds made up and you just gotta let them live and die with their beliefs. World still gonna keep turning whether they approve or not.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostGuys get injuries that any one of us can get because we're nerds on computers and game.
I'm not sure what your argument is here. Regular people can get these injuries from playing too? Yes. People can also injure themselves playing pickup games.
In both cases they are just alot less likely, and don't even prevent them completely from playing in the future. The issue with sports injuries is that they prevent the player from playing at the level they need to continue to be competitive. That's true in any video game or more traditional sport.
Video gaming is something that can be entertaining and has competitive elements. Does a disservice to its own immersion by trying to market itself as another traditional sport. That's actually what I've been getting at. Got sidetracked by hilarious posting about the athleticism that's apparently absent in golf/bowling.
Why do you think that though? I don't see how it's doing itself a disservice by marketing and positioning itself as something players can actually make a living through. That's the biggest difference to me between something like basketball and dota.
By HasphatsAnts Go To PostLike, why do we call performance cars "sporty"?Exactly. Not sure why people get so hung up on the word.
It's not like this is a sacred word not to be used in vain or anything.
By HasphatsAnts Go To PostWell if we're going there, Sport can also encompass things you do to amuse yourself. Like, "I consider it a great sport to annoy my girlfriend with horrible puns."
This definition removes the competitive and physical aspect of the word though. So it's not being used in the same way. When someone says esports they're not using the word in such a way. They're trying to use the word in it's traditional definition.
By Fenderputty Go To PostVigorous sweeping is more physically active than gaming.if you say so
How or why is video gaming a sport, like what are the actual tenable arguments for without resorting to demean another sport.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostHow or why is video gaming a sport, like what are the actual tenable arguments for without resorting to demean another sport.
Games are sports because at the end of the day, sports are just games.
They're all contests in which players display skill by performing a task or achieving a goal within the bounds of a constraining ruleset
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostHow or why is video gaming a sport, like what are the actual tenable arguments for without resorting to demean another sport.
I think the best arguments revolve around hand eye coordination, which is definitely a physical skill. Nobody has argued that though so ...
By Retro Go To PostGames are sports because at the end of the day, sports are just games.
This is a logical fallacy.
By Retro Go To PostThey're all contests in which players display skill by performing a task or achieving a goal within the bounds of a constraining rulesetSo everything is a sport as long as it can be made into a competition.
I think you're placing too much value in the athleticism behind sports.
When I think the majority of what makes them interesting are the rules.
Like alot of the most arbitrary rules in basketball exist primarily to make it not boring. Stuff like the shot clock, how long you can stand in the paint and even the dribbling rules have almost nothing to do with displaying any sort of athletic ability. They exist primarily because playing a game in which 10 dudes just run back and forth on a court throwing a ball into a hole would be incredibly uninteresting to both watch and play without the rules they've developed. No matter how exceptionally big and strong the players are.
When I think the majority of what makes them interesting are the rules.
Like alot of the most arbitrary rules in basketball exist primarily to make it not boring. Stuff like the shot clock, how long you can stand in the paint and even the dribbling rules have almost nothing to do with displaying any sort of athletic ability. They exist primarily because playing a game in which 10 dudes just run back and forth on a court throwing a ball into a hole would be incredibly uninteresting to both watch and play without the rules they've developed. No matter how exceptionally big and strong the players are.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostHow or why is video gaming a sport, like what are the actual tenable arguments for without resorting to demean another sport.that's like me asking for you not to shit on every reason someone gives for why they consider it a sport...
we both know that's not happening
I took you and giri to task for posting nonsense about Golf and Bowling, there's arguments to be made about gaming as a sport without making ridiculous statements about other sports that are factually untrue.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostSo everything is a sport as long as it can be made into a competition.
I wasn't really trying to say this exactly, but honestly I have no issue with the idea.
So long as they're fun and interesting and people care to play them, it makes no difference to me.
By Retro Go To PostI wasn't really trying to say this, but honestly I have no issue with the idea.Well that's what I gathered from your statement, I don't consider it right or wrong I just wonder where the line between competition and sport exists, if one does. If you say it doesn't that's fine, it's consistent /shrug.
So long as they're fun and interesting and people care to play them, it makes no difference to me.
Ah ok. I wasn't sure if you were leading me to accepting that something like OH I GUESS TOSSING PAPER IN A TRASH CAN is a sport, since other people have made similar reductionist arguments in here. My response was sort of geared to preemptively combat that. lol
but yes. I think any well defined, developed and designed contest of skill can be called a sport or game interchangeably.
but yes. I think any well defined, developed and designed contest of skill can be called a sport or game interchangeably.
By 33MillionDollarMen Go To PostI took you and giri to task for posting nonsense about Golf and Bowling, there's arguments to be made about gaming as a sport without making ridiculous statements about other sports that are factually untrue.you didn't take anyone to task really... and just being "tired" of people having different opinions than you doesn't make you the winner.
I still believe what I said... and like giri have bowled and play golf.
I have also played pool and thrown darts... all considered sports. It's not shitting on them to ask if x is a sport why can't gaming be?
By Retro Go To PostAh ok. I wasn't sure if you were leading me to accepting that something like OH I GUESS TOSSING PAPER IN A TRASH CAN is a sport, since other people have made similar reductionist arguments in here. My response was sort of geared to preemptively combat that. lolI just got bristly with the idea of trying to convince me gaming is a traditional sport, these other sports are not even athletic, etc. Straight up ass pulls isn't necessary in a discussion to try to qualify video gaming under the sports hub. Video gaming can be a sport if your definition is broad enough to include it. I'd want to see more physicality from it before I bestow upon it the label but in terms of everything else it's up there so whatever.
but yes. I think any well defined, developed and designed contest of skill can be called a sport or game interchangeably
It's weird to me that people went for trying to garrote other already qualified sports rather than argue for the merits of video gaming itself.
By blackace Go To PostI have also played pool and thrown darts... all considered sports. It's not shitting on them to ask if x is a sport why can't gaming be?
I would just like to point out that I don't consider pool, darts, chess, poker or shooting sports so I'm at least consistent. :P
By Fenderputty Go To PostI would just like to point out that I don't consider pool, darts, chess, poker or shooting sports so I'm at least consistent. :P
I doubt it honestly.
I'm sure if someone cared enough to get you to actually produce a definition of sport, and apply it to everything you deem isn't one as proof, the holes in your position would be made clear. As they would be with any exclusionary definition of sports.
That someone isn't me though
Pool and darts seem like weird exceptions actually. That's where it gets real hazy. The physicality is still central not incidental.
By Retro Go To PostI doubt it honestly.
I'm sure if someone cared enough to get you to actually produce a definition of sport, and apply it to everything you deem isn't one as proof, the holes in your position would be made clear. As they are with any exclusionary definition of sports.
That someone isn't me though
Maybe ... but that's a lot of competitive games someone would have to go through to prove my lack of consistency. :P
By Retro Go To PostI'm sure on some planet that was clever word play lol
And on that planet video games are probably sports too.
I don't think my definition is all that complicated to apply really. I basically take GIRI's definition he listed above (rules / competition) and add some physicality to it. /shrug
I would also like to clarify that I have a ton of respect for those to compete in gaming. I'm a 35 year old gamer ya know.
Regarding the definition of sport, my personal barometer is if a winner can clearly be defined by accomplishing an objective. So shit that is judged is automatically disqualified.
By that definition, esports is a sport even if I don't understand how anyone can watch people who likely need to bath play a MOBA for an extended period of time. Then again, the wealthiest people on YouTube are doing the same shit so what do I know...
Now excuse me as go back to reviewing tape on Smokey for our week 6 match up in Madden league play.
By that definition, esports is a sport even if I don't understand how anyone can watch people who likely need to bath play a MOBA for an extended period of time. Then again, the wealthiest people on YouTube are doing the same shit so what do I know...
Now excuse me as go back to reviewing tape on Smokey for our week 6 match up in Madden league play.
By PSYCH! Go To Postare videogames art?
Why not.
By PSYCH! Go To Postare videogames art?some, not all
throwing knife triple kills in destiny > bach tbh