Politics | 2017 | Decent human being defeats literal pedophile and piece of shit in a close senate election, signaling hope to America

2018 is gonna be fuckery of epic proportions on simply the lack of faith in the election procedures to begin with, with cheeto in office. I fully expect violence to go down on election days.

I mean I get you guys that have issues with the Democratic party...so why don't you fix it?

By TheHunter Go To PostI mean I get you guys that have issues with the Democratic party…so why don't you fix it?

when someone throws out criticisms or scrutiny, your response can't be more disingenuous than "why don't you just be batman?"

i mean, its strikingly apparent to a lot of the disenfranchised of the democratic party that many of the more inherently satisfied look past the ingrained shortcoming, long-term complacency, and outright waffling that's festered and led to the current situation where there's no other option than to sit around, wait, and hope the GOP fails - and then holds itself accountable for said failure

you can't just wave away genuine, pained criticism. i mean, you can, but at the same time taking that harsh evaluation with a bit of merit can only help to paint the picture of your own affiliated party

also you don't know what other people do. or don't do. its honestly enough to for people talk and educate each other on as much as possible within this capacity as one part of their overall political/social awareness

tl;dr: why don't you just impeach trump? lolz

By DY_nasty Go To Postwhen someone throws out criticisms or scrutiny, your response can't be more disingenuous than "why don't you just be batman?"

i mean, its strikingly apparent to a lot of the disenfranchised of the democratic party that many of the more inherently satisfied look past the ingrained shortcoming, long-term complacency, and outright waffling that's festered and led to the current situation where there's no other option than to sit around, wait, and hope the GOP fails - and then holds itself accountable for said failure

you can't just wave away genuine, pained criticism. i mean, you can, but at the same time taking that harsh evaluation with a bit of merit can only help to paint the picture of your own affiliated party

also you don't know what other people do. or don't do. its honestly enough to for people talk and educate each other on as much as possible within this capacity as one part of their overall political/social awareness

tl;dr: why don't you just impeach trump? lolz

I say that when they say they've given up.

You have to fight for progress...it isn't just given to you no matter how right it should be. That doesn't mean their criticism isn't right; I just wish people would understand The Dems are the only party currently fighting for whats right; like it or not we gotta work with what we got short of a revolution.

By TheHunter Go To PostI say that when they say they've given up.

You have to fight for progress…it isn't just given to you no matter how right it should be.

That's giving up?

Explain that. Because "Oh Jesus you aren't gonna get your perfect Unicorn candidate guys.

Man up and do the right thing." sounds a lot more like giving up in my opinion.

Its basically saying that people should roll over on chasing what they want out of their government entirely and that the only outcome is to 'man up' and accept politics that time and time again find ways to shortchange our outright sell its voters. And if Trump means that people are wrong for stating that they have to cringe on the way to the voting booth, even in support of his opposition, then doesn't that speak with an absolute clarity in regards to the current environment?

I'm not sure if you can call what you're talking about fighting for progress.

By DY_nasty Go To PostThat's giving up?


I'm not sure if you can call what you're talking about fighting for progress.

I mean standing out and not voting whilst a man who is literally destroying the EPA is the exact opposite of progress.

Any positive movement is better than nothing. I added into my original post to address the criticism being legit.

By TheHunter Go To PostThat doesn't mean their criticism isn't right; I just wish people would understand The Dems are the only party currently fighting for whats right; like it or not we gotta work with what we got short of a revolution.

This is based on faulty framing in general imo

A lot of the issues this country is currently dealing with are bipartisan to an extent. And when the party that you want to be progressive on these things gets the power to make the changes to ordeals that've been effecting this country for decades, what they do? They compromise with the stark conservatives before their own voters. OR they conveniently look away or frame issues in a light which removes them from the current spotlight. A lot of the rights being eroded away now have been previously chipped away on by other administrations. Its flatly disingenuous to say that everything is as it is now because of a presidency that's not even 2 years old.

But when they need voters, they'll go back to promising HBCUs blank checks, telling women that they care about them again, talking about water crises, defending burial grounds, or whatever else that sounds great and makes you feel good enough to go out on election day. Then its right back to bushes.

I can't even get all that mad with conservatives because they're straight up more or less.

So again, telling people to get with the program and stop looking for 'unicorns' should be a quick reminder as to why the left is treading water right now. God help them if the GOP actually gets its shit together.

By DY_nasty Go To PostThis is based on faulty framing in general imo

A lot of the issues this country is currently dealing with are bipartisan to an extent. And when the party that you want to be progressive on these things gets the power to make the changes to ordeals that've been effecting this country for decades, what they do? They compromise with the stark conservatives before their own voters. OR they conveniently look away or frame issues in a light which removes them from the current spotlight. A lot of the rights being eroded away now have been previously chipped away on by other administrations. Its flatly disingenuous to say that everything is as it is now because of a presidency that's not even 2 years old.

But when they need voters, they'll go back to promising HBCUs blank checks, telling women that they care about them again, talking about water crises, defending burial grounds, or whatever else that sounds great and makes you feel good enough to go out on election day. Then its right back to bushes.

I can't even get all that mad with conservatives because they're straight up more or less.

So again, telling people to get with the program and stop looking for 'unicorns' should be a quick reminder as to why the left is treading water right now. God help them if the GOP actually gets its shit together.

I can only speak here but in Illinois are governor is actually liberal now. If that bodes for all the other areas keep making demands they go left. Also understand if you want 60+ senate seats and the house you'll need centrist dems.

You aren't getting a leftist liberal in WV. If you want far left policies this country isn't ready without radical revolution.

By TheHunter Go To PostI mean standing out and not voting whilst a man who is literally destroying the EPA is the exact opposite of progress.

Any positive movement is better than nothing. I added into my original post to address the criticism being legit.

No one here said anything about not voting, but at the same time if there's ever such a widespread theme where people outright despise the 'good' candidate, then what does that say as a whole?

To stroll into 2018 with the same ambiance is asking for a disaster. The party needs to address this stuff sooner rather than later.

By DY_nasty Go To Postwhen someone throws out criticisms or scrutiny, your response can't be more disingenuous than "why don't you just be batman?"

i mean, its strikingly apparent to a lot of the disenfranchised of the democratic party that many of the more inherently satisfied look past the ingrained shortcoming, long-term complacency, and outright waffling that's festered and led to the current situation where there's no other option than to sit around, wait, and hope the GOP fails - and then holds itself accountable for said failure

you can't just wave away genuine, pained criticism. i mean, you can, but at the same time taking that harsh evaluation with a bit of merit can only help to paint the picture of your own affiliated party

also you don't know what other people do. or don't do. its honestly enough to for people talk and educate each other on as much as possible within this capacity as one part of their overall political/social awareness

tl;dr: why don't you just impeach trump? lolz

It's only fair when the criticism is actually valid. Yes, Democrats are obsessed with celebrities to an alarming degree, and my eyes start rolling through the back of my head whenever I see a "so and so destroys trump" headline. Liberal pearl clutching is stupendously dumb and the sooner the party gets rid of it the better.

But I also want to have substantive conversations around who will actually be able to deliver on what they promise to do. No one on the left seems interested to even prepare a defense for their positions that amounts to more than just "we should do it because it's going to work better for everybody"

Sorry, that's not good enough. Try again.

By HasphatsAnts Go To PostIt's only fair when the criticism is actually valid. Yes, Democrats are obsessed with celebrities to an alarming degree, and my eyes start rolling through the back of my head whenever I see a "so and so destroys trump" headline. Liberal pearl clutching is stupendously dumb and the sooner the party gets rid of it the better.

But I also want to have substantive conversations around who will actually be able to deliver on what they promise to do. No one on the left seems interested to even prepare a defense for their positions that amounts to more than just "we should do it because it's going to work better for everybody"

Sorry, that's not good enough. Try again.

This too.

Someone in here said $15 isn't enough. There is no way rural areas can afford that level on increase let alone more. Again, ya'll can criticize but realize you are not getting leftist policies left right and center. That is why the right is currently failing; they want all right all the time. The world doesn't work that way.

By HasphatsAnts Go To PostIt's only fair when the criticism is actually valid. Yes, Democrats are obsessed with celebrities to an alarming degree, and my eyes start rolling through the back of my head whenever I see a "so and so destroys trump" headline. Liberal pearl clutching is stupendously dumb and the sooner the party gets rid of it the better.

But I also want to have substantive conversations around who will actually be able to deliver on what they promise to do. No one on the left seems interested to even prepare a defense for their positions that amounts to more than just "we should do it because it's going to work better for everybody"

Sorry, that's not good enough. Try again.

I'm down for valid criticisms or even flatly ideological disagreements. In a perfect world, these things would be identified by obvious disclaimers or watermarks.

For the bolded, I am in clear and obvious pain each time I see the entire american media spotlight a cyclist flipping off the presidential motorcade as if someone just decapitated the lincoln memorial.

I'd actually be okay with dems not even getting shit done if they could at least be consistent long enough to get into office these days or to have a general workable theme at local/state levels. But its all over the place. And shitty.

By TheHunter Go To PostThis too.

Someone in here said $15 isn't enough. There is no way rural areas can afford that level on increase let alone more. Again, ya'll can criticize but realize you are not getting leftist policies left right and center. That is why the right is currently failing; they want all right all the time. The world doesn't work that way.

They don't give a shit about the world. They're honest.

A party so quick to throw minorities and women under the bus then expects people to have good faith in them. Abusive shit.

By DY_nasty Go To PostI'm down for valid criticisms or even flatly ideological disagreements. In a perfect world, these things would be identified by obvious disclaimers or watermarks.

For the bolded, I am in clear and obvious pain each time I see the entire american media spotlight a cyclist flipping off the presidential motorcade as if someone just decapitated the lincoln memorial.

I'd actually be okay with dems not even getting shit done if they could at least be consistent long enough to get into office these days or to have a general workable theme at local/state levels. But its all over the place. And shitty.

Thank Obama and his democratic bench.

We didn't build up anything once he got in.

By Random Ass Username Go To PostA party so quick to throw minorities and women under the bus then expects people to have good faith in them. Abusive shit.

Who here is advocating this?

Working with centrists means we throw them some bones in rural areas; not that we stop advocating social justice. Statements like this make no sense when Hillary had BLM mothers on stage at the DNC and called out GOPers for being deplorables.

By TheHunter Go To PostThis too.

Someone in here said $15 isn't enough. There is no way rural areas can afford that level on increase let alone more. Again, ya'll can criticize but realize you are not getting leftist policies left right and center. That is why the right is currently failing; they want all right all the time. The world doesn't work that way.

The minimum wage debate is incredibly annoying to me. There are winners and losers to a minimum wage raise. Instead of framing your argument around "no, those losers will actually benefit in the long run" or "these studies are actually bad. Read these good ones instead", come up with ways to mitigate those negative effects.

If you steadfastly refuse to admit that there will be people who are harmed by a particular policy you want implemented, then you're peddling the same intellectual dishonesty you accuse your opponents of. It's not a good way to win arguments.

By DY_nasty Go To PostThey don't give a shit about the world. They're honest.

They're also not accomplishing much.

By TheHunter Go To PostThank Obama and his democratic bench.

We didn't build up anything once he got in.

So again, why should people just shut up and be happy to fall in line with the dems?

If the GOP actually got its shit together, the dems would have nothing lol

they can't play the centrist game for any longer really

By TheHunter Go To PostThey're also not accomplishing much.

And that's why I'm not furious with Trump personally, and why I believe that people are only upset on a surface level.

He's inept, and this disdain for him is based more around the fact that he's running a circus more than what's he actually doing.

By TheHunter Go To PostThat is why the right is currently failing; they want all right all the time. The world doesn't work that way.

My nightmare scenario is a leftist version of the freedom caucus who blocks a public option because it's not single payer.

By DY_nasty Go To PostSo again, why should people just shut up and be happy to fall in line with the dems?

If the GOP actually got its shit together, the dems would have nothing lol

they can't play the centrist game for any longer really

Again...this was the most liberal DNC platform ever and leftists and social activists didn't show up enough.

Don't complain about a thing a Dev puts in, and when they take it out you still don't buy it. That is self-defeating.

By Fenderputty Go To PostMy nightmare scenario is a leftist version of the freedom caucus who blocks a public option because it's not single payer.

If that happens I will give up. Ya'll can keep hoping for that Leftist/liberal utopia. I'll be here in reality were we all have to make compromises.

I should know about issues getting thrown under a bus, I'm an environmentalist.

By HasphatsAnts Go To PostIt's only fair when the criticism is actually valid. Yes, Democrats are obsessed with celebrities to an alarming degree, and my eyes start rolling through the back of my head whenever I see a "so and so destroys trump"

You can't just let your eyes roll when you see those headlines. You have to internalize what's actually being said and have a few sleepless nights just to get started.

So often I see really smart people take a breather when someone they generally agree with has some fleeting, rhetorical victory. That's a part of the system that's fucking us, though. Like, I cringe whenever John Oliver's audience cracks up.. and sometimes I laugh with them. It's a huge problem that we let cathartic moments allow us to get up the next morning and be okay again.

By TheHunter Go To PostThey're also not accomplishing much.

Doing plenty harm rolling back CFPB protections and gutting the State Department.

We're seeing one of the worst droughts on record in Africa and our answer is cutting billions from the State Department budget earmarked for humanitarian aid.

By Fenderputty Go To PostMy nightmare scenario is a leftist version of the freedom caucus who blocks a public option because it's not single payer.

Lets be honest, most people who want the UHC dream don't even know what single payer is.

By TheHunter Go To PostAgain…this was the most liberal DNC platform ever and leftists and social activists didn't show up enough.

Don't complain about a thing a Dev puts in, and when they take it out you still don't buy it. That is self-defeating.

Can't be the most liberal anything with a Clinton involved

By butt Go To PostYou can't just let your eyes roll when you see those headlines. You have to internalize what's actually being said and have a few sleepless nights just to get started.

So often I see really smart people take a breather when someone they generally agree with has some fleeting, rhetorical victory. That's a part of the system that's fucking us, though. Like, I cringe whenever John Oliver's audience cracks up.. and sometimes I laugh with them. It's a huge problem that we let cathartic moments allow us to get up the next morning and be okay again.

Maybe Oprah will run for president!

By HasphatsAnts Go To PostDoing plenty harm rolling back CFPB protections and gutting the State Department.

We're seeing one of the worst droughts on record in Africa and our answer is cutting billions from the State Department budget earmarked for humanitarian aid.

I meant legislatively.

Can't do jack about the department heads.

By DY_nasty Go To PostLets be honest, most people who want the UHC dream don't even know what single payer is.

That's part of the problem leading to my nightmare scenario though. It's why populism scared me. Details don't matter.

Billionaire on billionaire crime

By DY_nasty Go To PostLets be honest, most people who want the UHC dream don't even know what single payer is.
Can't be the most liberal anything with a Clinton involved

And yet here we are talking about BLM still and how shit half the country's voting populace is.

She isn't the most liberal but she was liberal.

By Fenderputty Go To PostThat's part of the problem leading to my nightmare scenario though. It's why populism scared me. Details don't matter.

Populism, and direct democracy, are very scary ideas when you have a frightened, discouraged, busy, oppressed, undereducated, racist, non-reflective, arrogant, and drugged-up population.

By DY_nasty Go To PostCan't be the most liberal anything with a Clinton involved

This isn't accurate. Bernie may have helped get her there, but it was the most liberal platform.

Edit: just say it wasn't liberal enough. Not of that should have mattered anyway. This congress is useless

By TheHunter Go To PostAnd yet here we are talking about BLM still and how shit half the country's voting populace is.

She isn't the most liberal but she was liberal.

A liberal in name in a genuinely loose sense - and that's why people were vehemently unenthusiastic even with the doomsday scenario. If that's liberal, then what I am? It shouldn't be a midlife crisis to support your own party.

By Fenderputty Go To PostThat's part of the problem leading to my nightmare scenario though. It's why populism scared me. Details don't matter.

Populism is the game now, pleighboi

I will however say that the one thing i hate most about this environment is how people come so ready to deal with prepackaged talking points that are cut and pasted from a newsfeed/analysts/memes/etc

its just irritating to genuinely want to discuss some shit and get hit with yes or no questions ultimatums that are aimed to dumb down a debate to its most base form then introduce a punchline as quick as possible

THAT is new.

By butt Go To PostPopulism, and direct democracy, are very scary ideas when you have a frightened, discouraged, busy, oppressed, undereducated, racist, non-reflective, arrogant, and drugged-up population.

Just living is scary.

By DY_nasty Go To PostA liberal in name in a genuinely loose sense - and that's why people were vehemently unenthusiastic even with the doomsday scenario. If that's liberal, then what I am? It shouldn't be a midlife crisis to support your own party.
.

Dude my biggest issue is climate change and the only candidate that ever spoke about my topic at any length longer than soundbite lost in the primary putting up a hell of a fight. I still pulled the lever for her without hesitation.

And now my issue is apparently a hoax by the Chinese.

By DY_nasty Go To PostI will however say that the one thing i hate most about this environment is how people come so ready to deal with prepackaged talking points that are cut and pasted from a newsfeed/analysts/memes/etc

its just irritating to genuinely want to discuss some shit and get hit with yes or no questions ultimatums that are aimed to dumb down a debate to its most base form then introduce a punchline as quick as possible

THAT is new.

Part of the scariness of populism is this. Shit gets boiled down to a base level that hits the ordinary man in an emotional way. The current trend is news feeds and Facebook memes.

I also realize it's part of the game. Doesn't mean we're not playing with fire.

As if we don't have enough problems just from internal sources.

Wow.

Boy we're screwed aren't we.

By ClownsAreATen Go To PostBoy we're screwed aren't we.

yes

Well, when we Balkanize, I'll be voting to be annexed by California. Hope you guys do OK back east.

By ClownsAreATen Go To PostWell, when we Balkanize, I'll be voting to be annexed by California. Hope you guys do OK back east.

ima in florida, we gonna be mad max in paradise down here

Chicago asks to be apart of the Great Cali Coalition.

By TheHunter Go To PostChicago asks to be apart of the Great Cali Coalition.

I'll put a good word in for you.

By FreezePeach Go To Postima in florida, we gonna be mad max in paradise down here

😂

By DY_nasty Go To PostSo again, why should people just shut up and be happy to fall in line with the dems?

If the GOP actually got its shit together, the dems would have nothing lol

they can't play the centrist game for any longer really
And that's why I'm not furious with Trump personally, and why I believe that people are only upset on a surface level.

He's inept, and this disdain for him is based more around the fact that he's running a circus more than what's he actually doing.

How do you feel about the job being done by Sessions, Pruitt, Devos, and Carson, or the looming ideas of Clovis and Gorsuch? How do you feel about potentially getting a 401k nerf, a return to 2008-level banking regulations, lower-then Bush-level tax cuts paid for by cutting everything else, hand-waving of the Ferguson/Chicago DoJ reports, nationwide stop and frisk, and an economy dependent on burning coal a decade past the rest of the world? Or the admin working hand in hand with right wing media to spread propaganda and shut down transparency? North Carolina (and I know this affects you personally) isn't even considered a democracy on the world stage any longer after what went on after the last gubernatorial election. The fuckery going on at the EPA alone is enough for me to never consider sitting out an election - it's an existential imperative at this point.

The 2016, 2018, and 2020 elections were/are about more than hating on Trump. Trump's admin turning into a caricature of C. Montgomery Burns is a convenient reason to neuter a group that cares little for ethics or hiding its white nationalism, but even if Trump is gone, we still have President Pence and all that his party represents. Trump was simply the worst option available, and we had the dual phenomenon of the right gritting their teeth and saying, "eh, if you squint hard enough he's Ted Cruz" and the left saying "Hillary isn't Obama enough to be worth getting out of bed".

It's much easier to address the country's ills when dealing with the people who are at least trying to win your votes, much less with the people actively fighting on multiple fronts to limit the number of people voting. Giving the people who gleefully gutted the Voting Rights Act without batting an eye a free supreme court seat to teach the Dems a lesson isn't good strategy, or taking a stand, or principle; I can't think of very many things to call it that aren't outright insulting.

It's ridiculous how easy and cheap it was to manipulate people. You too can sow discord for the low low price of 300-200 dollars. Zuck doesn't give af.

I would rather get 12 dollars per hour(aka conservative light pile of dem shit) than getting hit by a car by a Nazi(aka very fine people).

But that is just me. Everyone has different preferences how they get steamrolled.

I waffled back and forth about making this post, because a part of me just wants to let it go. But I've seen some people throw around the term "useful idiots" directed at Berniecrats, and so I just feel like getting some thoughts off my chest now. I apologize in advance to all the innocent bystanders who might get in their feelings too.

By HasphatsAnts Go To PostO you mean that single payer bill that doesn't include any details on pay-fors?
We know what you want Bernie, you've only been yelling about this for decades. Tell us how you're gonna do it.

Where there's a will, there's a way:

The nuclear option is "quantitative easing."

It worked so well for the Iraq war. It worked for the bank bailouts. It might as well work for healthcare.

For example, the government bought out AIG not too long ago. Actual, literal, toxic assets. We bought those out. We rewarded failure. And we did so in the last decade, no less. So this is in recent memory, no amnesia here. And so I ask, why can't the government buy out Kaiser Permanente? Why can't we buy out something that is actually doing some good?

Maybe when real inflation is on the line, the billionaire class won't be so obstructionist and will actually try to make this shit work or gtfo. Maybe they'll come around to the idea that healthcare regulations can actually be a good thing. Maybe they'll see the wisdom in putting a "sin tax" on sugared goods; not on the consumers but on the manufacturers, doubly so for importers.

It honestly doesn't even really matter how we do it, it only matters that we do it. It's not even like we'd be the first to do it, either. We already provide defense for Europe, we can at least tell them to show us how to fix our shit. That would seem like getting our money's worth.

By Supha_Volt Go To PostI'm pretty sure it's Bernie's job to convince people about why they should vote for him and do whatever it takes to get their vote. If it means campaigning in the south then you go and campaign there in person if it gives you state during the primaries even if you you don't win it in the general.

If your plan for the south is word of mouth and tv then it's a shitty plan and it showed in the results or are you going to tell me that southern voters are "low information voters"?

I'm not trying to disregard anything else you're saying, because I do agree with you that it's Bernie's job to convince people about why they should vote for him. Hell, he sure convinced me, and I couldn't even tell you if he rallied in Maryland or not; it didn't matter.

But to address the bolded: Even during the best of times (see Obama's electoral maps), most Republican voters were southern voters (Texas? Louisiana? Alabama? Georgia? Missouri? South Carolina? etc. etc.). I wouldn't deem it too much a stretch of the imagination to suggest that southern voters are "low information voters"... They actively vote against their own best interests, that's kind of intuitive at this point.

By obijkenobi Go To PostAs mentioned earlier, minorities have heard the "tides rising all boats" rhetoric literally our entire lives. We know what it means. If you can't be bothered to talk to us, we can't be bothered to vote for you.;

For all of her faults, at least Hillary admitted her and Bill fucked up with their public safety policies int he 90s. I at least respected her for that, unlike Bernie "there's a southern part of the US??" Sanders.

Or as John Steinbeck once said, Hillary is just one of those millionaires who believes she's a temporarily embarrassed billionaire, which makes her extra not-shit.

Bernie never gave you one reason to think that his tide wouldn't raise all boats, but Hillary has actually been guilty of sinking boats. Bernie was the first to say black lives matter, Hillary tried to dodge the BLM question altogether. And you forgive her?

It's whatever, man. I'm just happy to have a healthy debate if one can be had. If y'all come at me, I owe you a favor.

It appears that the Clinton campaign was essentially running the DNC for close to a year before she clinched the nomination. The party was broke from mismanagement under Obama and Wasserman-Schultz, so the Clinton campaign essentially kept the DNC on an allowance in exchange for control.

This pisses me off, but stuff like this and Third Way's astroturfing should really piss off the party diehards. They're being set up to fail.

Hillary really was Cersei Lannister this whole time.

"Power is power."