I might have to hide from the internet for a few days. I'm hoping Tony Parker's injury is like Ibaka's or Reggie Jackson's, but so much is being said about how he was hobbled last year and how we have NO CHANCE without him.
We closed out OKC in the loudest arena in the NBA, in OT, without him, but still....
We closed out OKC in the loudest arena in the NBA, in OT, without him, but still....
Hey guys, I've been thinking who was in Shaq's "era" was and I can't really place it. He was drafted in between the mid 80's draft classes and the mid/late 90's draft class. Seems like his era was people drafted between 1990-1995 ish and it's a bunch of mediocre players or players who got derailed by injuries.
Penny
Grant Hill
Webber
Jason Kidd
Zo
Gary Payton
Those are pretty much the only names really worth mentioning. That's a pretty weak era
Jordan's is
Hakeem
Barkeley
Drexler
Stockton
Ewing
Reggie
David Robinson
Mark Jackson
Scottie
Joe Dumars
Damn, that's a hell of an era.
Timmy/Kobe's:
Kobe
Timmy
Nash
Garnett
Dirk
AI
Vince
McGrady
Ray Allen
Early 90's was just pure garbage or just careers cut short by injury. Damn...
Penny
Grant Hill
Webber
Jason Kidd
Zo
Gary Payton
Those are pretty much the only names really worth mentioning. That's a pretty weak era
Jordan's is
Hakeem
Barkeley
Drexler
Stockton
Ewing
Reggie
David Robinson
Mark Jackson
Scottie
Joe Dumars
Damn, that's a hell of an era.
Timmy/Kobe's:
Kobe
Timmy
Nash
Garnett
Dirk
AI
Vince
McGrady
Ray Allen
Early 90's was just pure garbage or just careers cut short by injury. Damn...
How much shit is wade on right now
His jaw is fucking comical
...When he gets got for PEDs....those *s going next to all the Miami titles.... :twisted:
The guy never had a sub 50 win year, never missed the playoffs, went to the finals in three fucking decades, yeah, let's totally focus on one time where he should've Latrell Sprewell his coach*, this is totally relevant when evaluating his career. No, no need to look at the Lakers teams post Shaq and pre Gasol, this is irrelevant, and god forbid never talk about that one time that Kobe bailed on his team in the playoff.Duncan over Kobe is already a no brainer.
aNot in my mind.
The lack of post season success from 2007-2008 until last year is the big reason why I say that. And the shit that happened last summer…And I love Tim…but no, just no, you don't allow yourself to be taken out of the game in such a crucial spot. Kobe would have died before he'd have let that happen. A little more assertiveness from Tim last year and he'd be looking at trying to repeat this year.
I agree, but Tim's deference to his coach is what distinguishes him from other GOATS.
that one is square on the coach
* while it was a fucking stupid mistake to take him out, let's not forget the Pop is a fucking brilliant coach, generally speaking, listening to him and doing what he wants is a good idea.
The guy never had a sub 50 win year, never missed the playoffs, went to the finals in three fucking decades, yeah, let's totally focus on one time where he should've Latrell Sprewell his coach*, this is totally relevant when evaluating his career. No, no need to look at the Lakers teams post Shaq and pre Gasol, this is irrelevant, and god forbid never talk about that one time that Kobe bailed on his team in the playoff.Duncan over Kobe is already a no brainer.
aNot in my mind.
The lack of post season success from 2007-2008 until last year is the big reason why I say that. And the shit that happened last summer…And I love Tim…but no, just no, you don't allow yourself to be taken out of the game in such a crucial spot. Kobe would have died before he'd have let that happen. A little more assertiveness from Tim last year and he'd be looking at trying to repeat this year.
I agree, but Tim's deference to his coach is what distinguishes him from other GOATS.
that one is square on the coach
* while it was a fucking stupid mistake to take him out, let's not forget the Pop is a fucking brilliant coach, generally speaking, listening to him and doing what he wants is a good idea.
What are you arguing right now? Yes Kobe had to deal with multiple rebuilding phases and 7 coaches whereas Timmy had Pop and some combination of Robinson/Parker/Ginobli his ENTIRE career + such loaded and deep teams that he could routinely manage his minutes and still finish with the best record in the league. That's the gist of your argument.
Again, R.C. Buford > Mitch and you're just making my point by arguing about the consistency of the franchise.
Kobe spent his ABSOLUTE PRIME on a shit team because his owner wanted to cash the check while paying his starting PG 800K a year. No other top 10 icon had to deal with that kind of shit. Kobe demands a trade, LA swings one trade, gets one actual all star caliber player, and he's back in the Finals.
If LA had the consistency of SA those 3 years, he'd have at least 1-2 more chips, and Timmy would have lost one or two of his.
Kobe has astonishing highs, Duncan is the more well rounded player with a more balanced impact on the game. If I had to choose between the two with the benefit of complete hindsight, Id pick Duncan, the man is a rock on the court and off. Kobe is fucking volatile man. He's moody, fights with coaches, airs out his teammates publicly, goes multiple possessions where he is absolutely determined to put up a shot regardless of whose open, etc. Okay, so he can take over a game in a way Duncant cant. But I still wouldnt take him over Timmy.
I'm mainly arguing that making the case against Duncan greatness (to any degree) based on a game he went 30/17 at the age of 37 just because he didn't refuse to pull himself out is crazy.
But yeah, Kobe in his absolute prime had Bynum and Odom and was coached by Phil Jackson, and they still didn't crack 50 and got booted on the first round.
You put Duncan in a similar situation (of course the team would be built differently, but I'm talking same level of talent) and they fare much better.
But yeah, Kobe in his absolute prime had Bynum and Odom and was coached by Phil Jackson, and they still didn't crack 50 and got booted on the first round.
You put Duncan in a similar situation (of course the team would be built differently, but I'm talking same level of talent) and they fare much better.
I'm mainly arguing that making the case against Duncan greatness (to any degree) based on a game he went 30/17 at the age of 37 just because he didn't refuse to pull himself out is crazy.
But yeah, Kobe in his absolute prime had Bynum and Odom and was coached by Phil Jackson, and they still didn't crack 50 and got booted on the first round.
You put Duncan in a similar situation (of course the team would be built differently, but I'm talking same level of talent) and they fare much better.
That Bynum couldn't out compete Chris Mihm and Kwame Brown for a starting spot. So Lulz. And Lamar Odom was a Pf in a conference with KG, Dirk, TD, Pau, Amare, Boozer just off the top of my head.
He wasn't even the 7th best guy at his position in his conference. Odom was literally a middle of the pack starter in this league. But yea, I don't blame Timmy for what happened last summer, that was absurd.
Him being irrelevant from 09-2011 and losing in the first round to an 8th seed is inexcusable though.
Duncan has lost 6 series while having HCA by my math. Kobe's lost 2. Detroit/Dallas. That's it.
Odom was obviously a really good player and much better than Boozer. Calling him average only means you don't want to be taken seriously.
Not that you were anyway.
Odom was a good player, but he was never an All Star, and probably somewhere between 8-10 on starting PF's in this league back in 06/07. I don't think that's debatable. And Bynum was a teenager that couldn't stay on the court or beat out Kwame for a starting spot back then.
Bosh
Timmy
Dirk
KG
Pau
Amare
Boozer (was an all star in 07 and made the WCF)
Clippers Elton Brand
Those guys were all probably better than him back then. Let's say he was the 9th best PF in the league, but 8 of those guys were in the same conference.
Odom was obviously a really good player and much better than Boozer. Calling him average only means you don't want to be taken seriously.
Not that you were anyway.
Not that you were anyway.
Also, Bynom was a 12/10 guy and the starting center for most of the '06-'07 season.
p.s.
I'm not a huge fan of those advance stats (mainly because they take the fun out of the game) but I think one is telling -
Kobe wins when he's the 2nd best player in the team.
p.s.
I'm not a huge fan of those advance stats (mainly because they take the fun out of the game) but I think one is telling -
Kobe wins when he's the 2nd best player in the team.
Also, Bynom was a 12/10 guy and the starting center for most of the '06-'07 season.
p.s.
I'm not a huge fan of those advance stats (mainly because they take the fun out of the game) but I think one is telling -
Kobe wins when he's the 2nd best player in the team.
Win shares? good troll effort
Win shares? good troll effort';)
I had better.
Though it's hard to argue he was the best player on the team his first 3 rings.
Duncan was without a doubt the best player on all the Spurs championship teams.
Win shares? good troll effort';)
I had better.
Though it's hard to argue he was the best player on the team his first 3 championship.
He wasn't. But no 21 year old would be better than prime Shaq. He was All NBA Offense + Defense every year. Either 1st or 2nd team.
That made him a top 5 two way player in the league back then. That's not exactly your average beta.
He wasn't. But no 21 year old would be better than prime Shaq. He was All NBA Offense + Defense every year. Either 1st or 2nd team.That's not so much a knock on Kobe, but it does mean that you can't do 5 > 4 therefore Kobe > Duncan.
That made him a top 5 two way player in the league back then. That's not exactly your average beta.
He wasn't. But no 21 year old would be better than prime Shaq. He was All NBA Offense + Defense every year. Either 1st or 2nd team.That's not so much a knock on Kobe, but it does mean that you can't do 5 > 4 therefore Kobe > Duncan.
That made him a top 5 two way player in the league back then. That's not exactly your average beta.
Kobe's better than Duncan for several reasons. But I said if Timmy gets 5 he supplants Kobe which means I don't think Timmy 5 = Kobe 5 I give the edge to Timmy there because of Finals MVP's, even if Tony gets this one..and he will.
But I knock Timmy for never having to waste his prime to rebuild, keeping a genius coach his whole career, winning chips while Kobe was injured on a rebuilding team, and for LOSING 6 PLAYOFF SERIES WITH HOME COURT ADVANTAGE.
What's the point of them 50 win seasons if you lose with HCA? It's like most those Phx Nash great regular seasons, ultimately empty.
Too bad Kobe couldn't keep those averages up in the finals.Win shares? good troll effort';)
I had better.
Though it's hard to argue he was the best player on the team his first 3 championship.
He wasn't. But no 21 year old would be better than prime Shaq. He was All NBA Offense + Defense every year. Either 1st or 2nd team.
That made him a top 5 two way player in the league back then. That's not exactly your average beta.
Pau arguably outplayed him in the 09 and 10 Finals.
but are either these dudes better than LeBron?
the answer is no
duncan is in conversation with lebron
kobe is in that mitch richmond, latrell sprewell tier
Too bad Kobe couldn't keep those averages up in the finals.Win shares? good troll effort';)
I had better.
Though it's hard to argue he was the best player on the team his first 3 championship.
He wasn't. But no 21 year old would be better than prime Shaq. He was All NBA Offense + Defense every year. Either 1st or 2nd team.
That made him a top 5 two way player in the league back then. That's not exactly your average beta.
Pau arguably outplayed him in the 09 and 10 Finals.
Actin a damn fool
sorry breh 32 points while jacking up 27 shots a game…….westbrook is better
I think you meant to say 25 points while jacking up 21.5 shots a game?
Wade 2013 - 20/4/4.5/1.9/1.3 48% shooting
Gasol 2010 - 18.6/11.6/3.7/.7/2.6 48% shooting
If anyone got robbed, it's Wade in 2013
Can we not do this, seriously... I'm pretty sure nobody here's going to change his or her mind because of something someone says in this thread.
ya'll let vahagn on here, you know damn well what you gonna get
especially in this dead period waiting for the Finals
especially in this dead period waiting for the Finals
09 finals is 32 on 27 shotssorry breh 32 points while jacking up 27 shots a game…….westbrook is better
I think you meant to say 25 points while jacking up 21.5 shots a game?
10 is 29 on 23 shots
i said finals
09 finals is 32 on 27 shotssorry breh 32 points while jacking up 27 shots a game…….westbrook is better
I think you meant to say 25 points while jacking up 21.5 shots a game?
10 is 29 on 23 shots
i said finals
...Those were Lebron numbers son. 25 points on 21.5 shots in 2013.
since when were we talking about lebron?09 finals is 32 on 27 shotssorry breh 32 points while jacking up 27 shots a game…….westbrook is better
I think you meant to say 25 points while jacking up 21.5 shots a game?
10 is 29 on 23 shots
i said finals
…Those were Lebron numbers son. 25 points on 21.5 shots in 2013.
since when were we talking about lebron?09 finals is 32 on 27 shotssorry breh 32 points while jacking up 27 shots a game…….westbrook is better
I think you meant to say 25 points while jacking up 21.5 shots a game?
10 is 29 on 23 shots
i said finals
…Those were Lebron numbers son. 25 points on 21.5 shots in 2013.
Since you decided to troll and I showed you that Wade got robbed worse than Pau did.
son.
lol
so you deflected
k
Naw, I addressed it head on saying you're actin a damn fool. If you think a guy scoring ~18 a game should get finals MVP over a guy scoring ~30 and running the entire offense that just warrants a "c'mon son" response.
But, since you felt it imperative to not realize the inherent absurdity of that notion, I showed you how preposterous it would be if you stuck with your logic by applying it to Wade/Lebron last year.
Lebron scored less than Kobe did on a crappy %. And Wade scored more than Gasol did.
If none of that is worth anything, let me direct you to the fact that Pau Gasol has NEVER won a playoff game sans-Kobe. And you think that beta deserves MVP for some decent Fg%?
Actin a damn fool.
So usually the all time greats wait until their previous era gets older, then when they hit their prime they dominate their generation's rivals for about a decade.
West/Russell dominated theirs.
Magic/Bird dominated theirs
Jordan dominated his
Kobe/Timmy dominated theirs...
...Lebron joined forces with his. Bitch ass...
West/Russell dominated theirs.
Magic/Bird dominated theirs
Jordan dominated his
Kobe/Timmy dominated theirs...
...Lebron joined forces with his. Bitch ass...
you two have enough opinions to have your own megathread.im just trying to get to 3k posts before the finals.
Heat in 5
LeBron gonna average 35/8/8, 58% shooting
Wade - 21/5/5 on 55% shooting
Bosh 17/6 50% shooting
Duncan - 24/12 on 50% shooting
Parker(hobbled or not) - 16/5 on 45% shooting
Leonard - 17/9 on 50% shooting
Ginobli - 15/7(turnovers)
3 peat.
I just feel like if there's someone I can troll about Lebron being a scared coat tail riding wussy. It's the author of this post right here.
you two have enough opinions to have your own megathread.im just trying to get to 3k posts before the finals.
You need a hobby bro.
I feel like I can easily reset your post count to 0. Yep. I can.you two have enough opinions to have your own megathread.im just trying to get to 3k posts before the finals.
