Does any big club lose their best players as easily as Schalke does?
Feel like they get fuck all for them
Feel like they get fuck all for them
Depends on what you think is easy I suppose. In my view it's not no different than us or Benfica and Porto for that matter. We all get a bunch of money for a good player, sometimes a lot, sometimes a bit less. And we start over again. It's how the football pyramid works.
I was amused yesterday that Michael Oliver was the only one without a recent haircut. A few fresh fades out there…
By Hitch Go To PostCan't deny that watching his goal from yesterday made me a bit sadAt least there is a gulf between Klopp and Lampard
Would have either excelled here or bought some legit depth. Can't see him flopping for some reason.
By Linius Go To PostDepends on what you think is easy I suppose. In my view it's not no different than us or Benfica and Porto for that matter. We all get a bunch of money for a good player, sometimes a lot, sometimes a bit less. And we start over again. It's how the football pyramid works.Benfica especially seem to get silly money for their players. Porto have made an absolute balls of letting their players' contracts run down recently, which is more what I was talking about.
Maybe my view is coloured by the fact that a lot of Schalke's players go to Bayern, which must fucking suck even when they get decent money.
Draxler is the only one I can think of who they've got good money for, and sold him abroad.
big debate: pep's (not to discredit his own influences, but for easiness' sake) most direct influence on current football is the possession-style football most teams choose to play nowadays, certainly in bringing the ball out from the back - as well as the counter-pressing style set up to negate the 'tiki-taka' brand of football.
however, i think what's interesting - particularly in the premier league at the moment i suppose, but it happens everywhere - is nostalgia and sentimentality at a coaching/boardroom level. of course, it's happened before that favoured sons go to manage particular teams: cruyff at ajax and barcelona, bobby robson and kevin keegan at newcastle, kenny dalglish.
but it seems there's a current fetishisation for the notion of a manager 'getting it'; getting the club, getting what it stands for, etc., and i think we can link that back to pep's team not only being so successful but also playing the 'barca' way. that sense of the way your team takes to the pitch really correlating with the identity of the club itself. in recent times alone, conte has taken over juventus, zidane and simeone at the madrids, and then even experiments like kovac at bayern - their standing as club legends will have helped them to garner those jobs. in fact, kovac probably had the best managerial cv of those four (not to discredit simeone's argentinian exploits) when hired by their clubs.
you'll always get outliers in that regard - mourinho didn't have any particular affinity with any of his clubs, nor too klopp (outside of mainz), nor too pep outside of barca - but i've found it really interesting, especially this year, how the premier league has responded.
of the 20 current premier league clubs:
- six are managed by former players (arsenal, bournemouth, chelsea, palace, man utd, sheff utd)
- three are managed by boyhood fans of the club (villa, newcastle, sheff utd; we could also be cheeky and add croydon-born roy hodgson to the list)
what's also interesting, especially in the cases of the 'top 6 clubs', is their ages. the premier league is veering younger in its coaching profiles; and not just young, but inexperienced too. arteta's first head coach job in football is at a club the size of arsenal. a year at derby was enough to take lampard into the chelsea job. and of course solskjaer was only tested by molde and cardiff before landing the united job (albeit in different circumstances due to 'the miracle in paris'). wilder and smith are only a few years older than solskjaer themselves, with a little more time on the clock.
which leads us to why football has come back in the time of corona. because emotion, as much as money, fuels the game. sentimentality and nostalgia currently accounts for why three members of the erstwhile top six are managed by coaches without much of a cv, and why they'll be given time others won't. that same sentimentality also means (in my case, at least) there's more of a neutral pull towards the likes of villa and sheff utd, to see fans like you or i bring glory to their own club. imagine if steve bruce was the one to end the newcastle trophy drought.
this has even permeated its way into boardroom level; one only needs to look at edu as sporting director of arsenal, or petr cech at chelsea, or the much-discussed players' panel of rio and darren fletcher that ed woodward spoke to in a vain attempt to 'get it'. the fetishisation of sentiment makes it so much easier to develop those ties with your club, to see people who delighted you as players continue to do so as manager.
but what happens when it goes wrong? when alan shearer sleepwalks newcastle into relegation? when martin o'neill or stuart pearce fail miserably at nottingham forest? it'll be a sad day when solskjaer or lampard are inevitably sacked, because the natural reaction in times of trouble for football fans is to get on the manager's back - and that'll feel all the ickier when it's a club legend being turned on.
i am curious to see where the premier league goes next; will liverpool turn to gerrard when klopp leaves? will city look to bring kompany back, or bring david silva into their coaching fold as soon as possible? will james tarkowski be burnley's next head coach? will grant hanley be the 'marina of east anglia'? one can only wait in anticipation.
(this long read is brought to you by the writer of 'david moyes should see out his six year contract and become the legend who doesn't have to win to be a winner')
however, i think what's interesting - particularly in the premier league at the moment i suppose, but it happens everywhere - is nostalgia and sentimentality at a coaching/boardroom level. of course, it's happened before that favoured sons go to manage particular teams: cruyff at ajax and barcelona, bobby robson and kevin keegan at newcastle, kenny dalglish.
but it seems there's a current fetishisation for the notion of a manager 'getting it'; getting the club, getting what it stands for, etc., and i think we can link that back to pep's team not only being so successful but also playing the 'barca' way. that sense of the way your team takes to the pitch really correlating with the identity of the club itself. in recent times alone, conte has taken over juventus, zidane and simeone at the madrids, and then even experiments like kovac at bayern - their standing as club legends will have helped them to garner those jobs. in fact, kovac probably had the best managerial cv of those four (not to discredit simeone's argentinian exploits) when hired by their clubs.
you'll always get outliers in that regard - mourinho didn't have any particular affinity with any of his clubs, nor too klopp (outside of mainz), nor too pep outside of barca - but i've found it really interesting, especially this year, how the premier league has responded.
of the 20 current premier league clubs:
- six are managed by former players (arsenal, bournemouth, chelsea, palace, man utd, sheff utd)
- three are managed by boyhood fans of the club (villa, newcastle, sheff utd; we could also be cheeky and add croydon-born roy hodgson to the list)
what's also interesting, especially in the cases of the 'top 6 clubs', is their ages. the premier league is veering younger in its coaching profiles; and not just young, but inexperienced too. arteta's first head coach job in football is at a club the size of arsenal. a year at derby was enough to take lampard into the chelsea job. and of course solskjaer was only tested by molde and cardiff before landing the united job (albeit in different circumstances due to 'the miracle in paris'). wilder and smith are only a few years older than solskjaer themselves, with a little more time on the clock.
which leads us to why football has come back in the time of corona. because emotion, as much as money, fuels the game. sentimentality and nostalgia currently accounts for why three members of the erstwhile top six are managed by coaches without much of a cv, and why they'll be given time others won't. that same sentimentality also means (in my case, at least) there's more of a neutral pull towards the likes of villa and sheff utd, to see fans like you or i bring glory to their own club. imagine if steve bruce was the one to end the newcastle trophy drought.
this has even permeated its way into boardroom level; one only needs to look at edu as sporting director of arsenal, or petr cech at chelsea, or the much-discussed players' panel of rio and darren fletcher that ed woodward spoke to in a vain attempt to 'get it'. the fetishisation of sentiment makes it so much easier to develop those ties with your club, to see people who delighted you as players continue to do so as manager.
but what happens when it goes wrong? when alan shearer sleepwalks newcastle into relegation? when martin o'neill or stuart pearce fail miserably at nottingham forest? it'll be a sad day when solskjaer or lampard are inevitably sacked, because the natural reaction in times of trouble for football fans is to get on the manager's back - and that'll feel all the ickier when it's a club legend being turned on.
i am curious to see where the premier league goes next; will liverpool turn to gerrard when klopp leaves? will city look to bring kompany back, or bring david silva into their coaching fold as soon as possible? will james tarkowski be burnley's next head coach? will grant hanley be the 'marina of east anglia'? one can only wait in anticipation.
(this long read is brought to you by the writer of 'david moyes should see out his six year contract and become the legend who doesn't have to win to be a winner')
Can you have one of the guys from Tifo read it out for me and put in some animation to support the story? Give me a 3 minute video and I'll watch it during dinner.
I'm hiring n8 to write my eulogy, and you better end it with Ashen one, hearest thou my voice, still? 
Pep's been the worst thing to happen to football for a long time on several levels
I don't like hiring inexperienced former legends, it's way too risky and sometimes I feel like its done just to numb the fans for a while until something better comes along if ever. The noises will certainly be less toxic too...just cowardly
Ciro Ferrara was abysmal but he was still wildly respected and loved both during and after his sacking, so I wouldn't worry too much about Ole's standing with the fans. At least you know they gonna give their all, even if their all isn't good enough.
guys drop the one liners and give the man the time of day, I wanna talk football not exchange jokes.
Pep's been the worst thing to happen to football for a long time on several levels
I don't like hiring inexperienced former legends, it's way too risky and sometimes I feel like its done just to numb the fans for a while until something better comes along if ever. The noises will certainly be less toxic too...just cowardly
Ciro Ferrara was abysmal but he was still wildly respected and loved both during and after his sacking, so I wouldn't worry too much about Ole's standing with the fans. At least you know they gonna give their all, even if their all isn't good enough.
guys drop the one liners and give the man the time of day, I wanna talk football not exchange jokes.
By Hitch Go To PostBenfica especially seem to get silly money for their players. Porto have made an absolute balls of letting their players' contracts run down recently, which is more what I was talking about.
Maybe my view is coloured by the fact that a lot of Schalke's players go to Bayern, which must fucking suck even when they get decent money.
Draxler is the only one I can think of who they've got good money for, and sold him abroad.
He's called Jorge Mendes.
https://egolo.site/o-carrossel-de-jogadores-do-jorge-mendes/
I think it's the culmination of the move away from the manager being the number one in charge to the kind of collaborative thought that I'd associate with US sports teams (coach, GM, executives, backroom staff etc), but also that the English top 6 are too big to fail. These clubs are more coordinated in terms of sports science, opposition analysis, analytics/stats (at the club and for transfers) and the training ground coaching, and have endless budgets.
That being said, there's questions over most of these areas at United, Arsenal and to a lesser extent Chelsea. It's difficult to rationalize their coaching choices although I was pro-Arteta moreso than for the other two managers.
I think for Liverpool, Gerrard (or Ljinders) would be deemed acceptable managers because the other three aspects of the club are at a world class standard and they can basically gamble on the coach. But again, Edwards is said to constantly be scouting and keeping dossiers on managers, so I wouldn't guarantee that it will be Gerrard.
I think it's funny to think that the analytics department we have now is the same as Rodgers had, and yet there was all the whining about transfer committees and ultimately a fudge that didn't benefit the club.
That being said, there's questions over most of these areas at United, Arsenal and to a lesser extent Chelsea. It's difficult to rationalize their coaching choices although I was pro-Arteta moreso than for the other two managers.
I think for Liverpool, Gerrard (or Ljinders) would be deemed acceptable managers because the other three aspects of the club are at a world class standard and they can basically gamble on the coach. But again, Edwards is said to constantly be scouting and keeping dossiers on managers, so I wouldn't guarantee that it will be Gerrard.
I think it's funny to think that the analytics department we have now is the same as Rodgers had, and yet there was all the whining about transfer committees and ultimately a fudge that didn't benefit the club.
By Cleff Go To PostAlmost there...
Think that’s fair enough tbh. You all know my feelings on him; wonderful, wonderful player. But injuries have done a bit of a number on him, and he is much better in a counter-attacking side.
ole sign him up
ole sign him up
By Vini.lad Go To PostI thought Batong was bald??
Have we been solidly linked with him? Not seen much of that from this side.
No idea who we'll be looking to buy in the summer, assuming we have the money.
No idea who we'll be looking to buy in the summer, assuming we have the money.
By Hitch Go To PostHave we been solidly linked with him? Not seen much of that from this side.Coutbackinho
No idea who we'll be looking to buy in the summer, assuming we have the money.
By inky Go To PostCoutbackinhoI'd take it if he was cheap as shit
We've refined our system now though to the point that it doesn't make sense to shoehorn him into it as a starter.
By Xpike Go To PostI'd buy kantelove him as a player but the time to get him was when he left Leicester. too many miles on those legs w/ his style of play. i'd buy whoever i thought was the next kante
By Hitch Go To PostI'd take it if he was cheap as shitIt's kind of strange to even see links; if Liverpool didn't go for Werner at 50mil, there's no way they'll take Coutinho back on anything but extremely generous terms. Barca aren;t going to just give him away
We've refined our system now though to the point that it doesn't make sense to shoehorn him into it as a starter.
By Pennywise Go To PostDamn. Havertz all but confirmed.
Hitch fuming.
By inky Go To PostCoutbackinhoCoutinhome
Just looked on wiki, I didn't realise he was the second most expensive player of all time when he moved. Yikes
huh
Suspended to me implies that something dodgy has been going on. If they've decided that he's incompetent, why bother doing that?
Suspended to me implies that something dodgy has been going on. If they've decided that he's incompetent, why bother doing that?
At first I assumed it was a joke about the whataboutism used to attack gestures like that, but apparently no.
They hired a nanny and refused to pay her wages (which were comically low for what he earns). Was ordered by the courts to pay her after a complaint.
By n8 dogg Go To PostThink that’s fair enough tbh. You all know my feelings on him; wonderful, wonderful player. But injuries have done a bit of a number on him, and he is much better in a counter-attacking side.loving the Latrice Royale avatar.
ole sign him up
By sohois Go To PostThis is so pathetic, how can anyone be this disconnected from reality? It's almost inhumane.
wait, what?
Anyways, Valencia v Madrid coming up in less than 1h, watch us sufrir.
