What are you babbling about? "You can't vet" and then you say there's a long vetting process. Like, I don't even understand how your 2nd paragraph is supposed to contradict anything I said...or even really address it. Snyder said he wants refugees vetted first. The US i]does vet every single refugee. Like you mention, it's a long fucking process. So why is he still refusing refugees when his issues have been addressed (or rather his ignorance has).
It's also the type of policy that leads to millions of people suffering and dying unnecessarily.
but lol as if this has anything to do with security and not xenophobia and politics. Sometimes it's the former, other times the latter, and still other times both. But let's get this straight, this is not about security at fucking all.
Edit: and when it concerns security, I'm not going to be against someone ignorantly prioritizing personal safety. Its a hell of a lot better than ignorantly not.
It's also the type of policy that leads to millions of people suffering and dying unnecessarily.
but lol as if this has anything to do with security and not xenophobia and politics. Sometimes it's the former, other times the latter, and still other times both. But let's get this straight, this is not about security at fucking all.
Dy, i'm sure that this situation is different. But what's NOT different is the intelligence community telling us there are risks. You may be right that this isn't Vietnam - but the arguments about "safety" are the same.
For a hundred years it was Xenophobia mixed in with threats of spies and communist sympathizers. Now it's Xenophobia mixed with threats of terrorists and Islamist extremism.
20 years from now the intelligence community will tell us "the threat has evolved, we should be better safe than sorry" - then 20 years after that then 20 years after that.
When IWMTB or anyone else mention Jewish refugees or Vietnamese refugees we're not suggesting that the risks are analogous. We're suggesting that the claims about this severity and uniqueness of the risks are analogous.
How many times in the past has the intelligence community said "oh yea were good, we got it handled bring all the refugees you want"? It seems like we're always hearing about the risks and the threats and "better safe than sorry" rhetoric mixed in with racism and bigotry from the general populace or shitty politicians.
For a hundred years it was Xenophobia mixed in with threats of spies and communist sympathizers. Now it's Xenophobia mixed with threats of terrorists and Islamist extremism.
20 years from now the intelligence community will tell us "the threat has evolved, we should be better safe than sorry" - then 20 years after that then 20 years after that.
When IWMTB or anyone else mention Jewish refugees or Vietnamese refugees we're not suggesting that the risks are analogous. We're suggesting that the claims about this severity and uniqueness of the risks are analogous.
How many times in the past has the intelligence community said "oh yea were good, we got it handled bring all the refugees you want"? It seems like we're always hearing about the risks and the threats and "better safe than sorry" rhetoric mixed in with racism and bigotry from the general populace or shitty politicians.
Ignorantly prioritizing personal safety is one of the main reasons America has millions of people in prison and 1000s of people get shot to death by the police per year.
Obama's been on a tear the last few days while speaking to and answering questions from the press. He's going to kill so many more people before his time is up. Even a racist piece of shit like Harry Truman would be proud.
By IWMTB19 Go To PostIgnorantly prioritizing personal safety is one of the main reasons America has millions of people in prison and 1000s of people get shot to death by the police per year.rolling a bunch of issues into one
By Mamba Go To PostWhat are you babbling about? "You can't vet" and then you say there's a long vetting process. Like, I don't even understand how your 2nd paragraph is supposed to contradict anything I said…or even really address it. Snyder said he wants refugees vetted first. The US i]does vet every single refugee. Like you mention, it's a long fucking process. So why is he still refusing refugees when his issues have been addressed (or rather his ignorance has).What do you think vetting is?
It's also the type of policy that leads to millions of people suffering and dying unnecessarily.
but lol as if this has anything to do with security and not xenophobia and politics. Sometimes it's the former, other times the latter, and still other times both. But let's get this straight, this is not about security at fucking all.
Yahoo News asked Trump whether this level of tracking might require registering Muslims in a database or giving them a form of special identification that noted their religion. He wouldn’t rule it out.
“We’re going to have to — we’re going to have to look at a lot of things very closely,” Trump said when presented with the idea. “We’re going to have to look at the mosques. We’re going to have to look very, very carefully.”
https://www.yahoo.com/politics/donald-trump-has-big-plans-1303117537878070.html
Not Germany 1937.
Rand Paul goes balls out, says we essentially need a dome around the United States and to never let anyone in because the terries could be anyone:
God bless America.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/18/politics/rand-paul-french-citizens-paris-syria/index.html
"I think our biggest entry for those who would attack us is coming to visit, basically, coming as a refugee or coming as a visitor or coming as a student," Paul said, saying the U.S. welcomes 150,000 students from the Middle East per year. "We also have to be concerned about French citizens coming here. Most of the people involved in the attack, I think, are going to turn out to be French citizens. … I would stop that. I would say nobody comes unless they're part of Global Entry."
Global Entry is a program that fast-tracks international access for travelers who have already gone through a background check and screening.
God bless America.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/18/politics/rand-paul-french-citizens-paris-syria/index.html
:facepalm:
I'm sure a significant portion of Republicans would just say that you can't trust the government or media if you gave them the official statistics.
By DY_nasty Go To PostWhat do you think vetting is?You tell me cuz you contradicted yourself in the same paragraph on it.
By KingGondo Go To PostI'm sure a significant portion of Republicans would just say that you can't trust the government or media if you gave them the official statistics.
Like, I get this argument...but it still makes no sense in the end. I mean, how stupid do you have to be to think more people are unemployed today than in 2009 when Obama took over and nearly 1 million people a month were being laid off. You don't need the government to give you any statistic. In 2009, it felt like every other person was being fired. Businesses were being boarded up. Nobody was shopping. These aren't things you need to see data on. You go out every day and see it with your own eyes. You go out today and this is clearly not the case. Companies are obviously hiring. Shops are back. How many people do you know getting laid off monthly?
It's such a "not in reality" position to hold. Like, it's fine to think Obama has harmed the recovery (that is that we would have recovered faster if not for him) but to think that things have gotten worse since Jan/Feb 2009 is basically living in a fantasy realm. It's so disjointed from reality it makes my head hurt.
And 25% of so-called Dems think it too! And others said "not sure" which makes me think they're just morons because the other group is just suffering from hallucinations.
Regarding Rand/Trump and all this BS. For fuck's sake, I'm far far far more afraid of an America citizen who is either mentally ill, angry about something, racist, or something within such realm killing me during my Star Wars move experience opening weekend than I am of a terrorist killing me. I'm not saying we should focus on terrorist, of course, but our priorities are so fucked up.
Shit, I'm more likely to be killed by some moronic driver, because believe me, driving is the #1 threat to my life in SoCal with all these transplants having no idea how to drive properly. Our driving exams are a much bigger threat to my safety than our visa programs...
Are we surprised? These people have been brainwashed into thinking Reagan lowered the deficit, Obama's a Muslim, His birth certificate isn't real, 5 year old children are threats, climate change is a hoax, Sandy Hook was a government conspiracy, Obama's taking their guns, BLM thinks white people's lives don't matter.
History will record this time as Nazi Germany level propaganda - when an institution was able to convince a large group of people of virtually anything at all. Shit dude, Fox can tell them that the Sky and the Ocean both being blue is a result of God's intelligent matching design sense for 3 months and we'd be hearing "matching colors" as an argument for Creationism.
Their brains have been thoroughly scrubbed and brainwashed. They will believe absolutely anything that Fox and Rush tell them repeatedly.
History will record this time as Nazi Germany level propaganda - when an institution was able to convince a large group of people of virtually anything at all. Shit dude, Fox can tell them that the Sky and the Ocean both being blue is a result of God's intelligent matching design sense for 3 months and we'd be hearing "matching colors" as an argument for Creationism.
Their brains have been thoroughly scrubbed and brainwashed. They will believe absolutely anything that Fox and Rush tell them repeatedly.
Misinformation from politicians is pretty common, I would prefer to save my Nazi comparisons for Trump because he's going in right now:
Trump to NBC on whether his WH would implement database tracking Muslims: "i would certainly implement that. Absolutely." Video coming…
By Fenderputty Go To PostTrump and his base are solidifying my opinion that republicans are becoming fascists.They've always been on many levels. Women's reproductive rights is the most obvious example.
But this shit is getting scary. I can't believe what I'm hearing these days. A Muslim database? Holy shit. Why is no one interviewing him saying "Are you out of your fucking mind? What is wrong with you? Are you demented or evil?"
Rabid dogs. Muslim database. They're not even conveying the pretense of human decency anymore. Just devolving into full blown fascism at this point.
Donald Trump stuck a toe across the Nazi line Thursday morning in the ongoing hysteria over Muslim immigrants.
The Republican presidential frontrunner refused to rule out requiring Muslims to carry special identification showing their faith — which the Third Reich required Jews to do with a yellow badge that resembled the Star of David.
yeah that's a good idea
By 3SidedPolygons Go To PostRabid dogs. Muslim database. They're not even conveying the pretense of human decency anymore. Just devolving into full blown fascism at this point.
That's what I"m saying. They've flirted with that term before, but they've riled the far right base up enough that they've become full on fascists now. A black man as president and 8 years of fear mongering.
Another group of people with no grasp of history comparing the Syrian refugee crisis to the Jewish refugee crisis of the 30s, smh:
http://www.ushmm.org/information/press/press-releases/museum-statement-on-syrian-refugees
WASHINGTON, DC—Acutely aware of the consequences to Jews who were unable to flee Nazism, the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum looks with concern upon the current refugee crisis. While recognizing that security concerns must be fully addressed, we should not turn our backs on the thousands of legitimate refugees.
The Museum calls on public figures and citizens to avoid condemning today’s refugees as a group. It is important to remember that many are fleeing because they have been targeted by the Assad regime and ISIS for persecution and in some cases elimination on the basis of their identity.
A living memorial to the Holocaust, the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum inspires citizens and leaders worldwide to confront hatred, prevent genocide, and promote human dignity. Its far-reaching educational programs and global impact are made possible by generous donors.
http://www.ushmm.org/information/press/press-releases/museum-statement-on-syrian-refugees
im still not completely convinced that Trump would actually take the presidency if it were offered to him
part of me thinks this started off as a glorified ego trip and has gone off the rails, and now he's just running with it with the idea that he has no real chance in the GE, so might as well say whatever
part of me thinks this started off as a glorified ego trip and has gone off the rails, and now he's just running with it with the idea that he has no real chance in the GE, so might as well say whatever
By IWMTB19 Go To PostAnother group of people with no grasp of history comparing the Syrian refugee crisis to the Jewish refugee crisis of the 30s, smh:"While recognizing that security concerns must be fully addressed"
http://www.ushmm.org/information/press/press-releases/museum-statement-on-syrian-refugees
hey look its that thing you still haven't talked about
still a bad comparison no matter how you look at it. yes its a group of people that some ignorant folk say dumb shit about... that's where it ends
By DY_nasty Go To Poststill a bad comparison no matter how you look at it. yes its a group of people that some ignorant folk say dumb shit about… that's where it ends
No, the question is international solidarity with the people who are first row in the face of the growth of xenophobic organizations.
By Gabyskra Go To PostNo, the question is international solidarity with the people who are first row in the face of the growth of xenophobic organizations.And hey, that's all well and good. But don't forget about the whole security part and how it is stupid to ignore the whole security part. Not everyone who brings it up is a racist. Which is what some people love to believe.
FBI director says "we're gonna have problems" then maybe tapping the breaks for a moment isn't the worst idea of all time.
By DY_nasty Go To PostAnd hey, that's all well and good. But don't forget about the whole security part and how it is stupid to ignore the whole security part. Not everyone who brings it up is a racist. Which is what some people love to believe.
I do not believe that. I believe world security will improve when we do not feed ISIS' narrative by ourselves having authoritarian regimes, self-serving nationalistic policies, and do more than just bomb civilians.
That's anecdotic, but how do you feel about Rand Paul calling for the end of the visa waiver for French people? How do you feel about Trump saying there's a need to monitor all muslims, etc? I feel the general climate is not rational.
By DY_nasty Go To PostAnd hey, that's all well and good. But don't forget about the whole security part and how it is stupid to ignore the whole security part. Not everyone who brings it up is a racist. Which is what some people love to believe.
FBI director says "we're gonna have problems" then maybe tapping the breaks for a moment isn't the worst idea of all time.
You completely ignored my post. Which is fine, I'll reiterate.
Please tell me a time when the FBI director, Intelligence community, military, whoever - told us that we're "not" going to have problems and that we should bring in refugees and we're good to go?
Was that the thinking in the 1930's? 1960's? 2000's?
I'm legitimately asking, I'm not sure.
By Gabyskra Go To PostI do not believe that. I believe world security will improve when we do not feed ISIS' narrative by ourselves having authoritarian regimes, self-serving nationalistic policies, and do more than just bomb civilians.Until that day comes, you gotta deal with the issue as it is.
That's anecdotic, but how do you feel about Rand Paul calling for the end of the visa waiver for French people? How do you feel about Trump saying there's a need to monitor all muslims, etc? I feel the general climate is not rational.
And the far right is just as aggressive and loud about those dumb things as ever. At the same time, I feel that looking the other way entirely and hearts/minding the issue when a new boldness of attacks in countries that haven't had to see that side of the war yet is just as bad in its own way. The entire thing needs a plan, and people are just talking end points. "We need to leave" okay - how? and at the same time, you let these organizations build momentum and you're dealing with an entirely different monster. "We need boots on the ground to uproot this once and for all" fine - are you ready for the bloodbath? "moar dronez, that way our soldiers don't die and we still bomb the bad guys" more removed approach means more mistakes and no direct solution at all
its all bullshit imo. as someone who's job deals with it directly, i can't disagree with anything even vaguely resembling a plan. so when states say "hold up" (texas in particular, not bama for example) then i'm not gonna say they're assholes for it - even knowing that people are going to turn into a shitty narrative
By 3SidedPolygons Go To PostYou completely ignored my post. Which is fine, I'll reiterate.I didn't ignore it. There's always problems. There will always be problems.
Please tell me a time when the FBI director, Intelligence community, military, whoever - told us that we're "not" going to have problems and that we should bring in refugees and we're good to go?
Was that the thinking in the 1930's? 1960's? 2000's?
I'm legitimately asking, I'm not sure.
The nature of the problem changes, threat changes, vulnerabilities change, etc.
The last big ones that I had to deal with were with Haiti and Libya. Many times, its not the country that suffered a disaster that's the source of the issue. Its the hops and jumps adjacent that make things complicated on our end. Stuff happens and countries can't even track their own people anymore, then another country lazily fills in the gaps with bad information or skips up in procedures, then the next, maybe another.... and then we have to sort all that out. That long road of mess isn't some secret though. Human trafficking is a nasty, long-standing, and extremely organized business and there's all sorts of shit that I'd rather forget about taking place.
Nobody is arguing that the gov't shouldn't do its due dilligence in making sure anyone who comes to this country, whether a refugee, tourist, immigrant, etc is a non-threat. Nobody. All we're saying is blanket statements about a group, ignorance, et al is bad.
Nobody has a problem if Texas says "Hey, US Gov't, can you assure me you're doing everything that needs to be done?" But when Texas says "No refugees. fingers in my ears, I don't care about your argument about how you're doing an exceptional job at screening them," then there's a problem.
You're defending that mindset and that's wrong. Flat out wrong. Shit, even the head republican on the foreign intelligence committee the other day said as much, though he blamed the problem on Obama for not properly communicating how we're actually being very thorough.
Nobody has a problem if Texas says "Hey, US Gov't, can you assure me you're doing everything that needs to be done?" But when Texas says "No refugees. fingers in my ears, I don't care about your argument about how you're doing an exceptional job at screening them," then there's a problem.
You're defending that mindset and that's wrong. Flat out wrong. Shit, even the head republican on the foreign intelligence committee the other day said as much, though he blamed the problem on Obama for not properly communicating how we're actually being very thorough.
http://www.lrb.co.uk/v37/n23/adam-shatz/magical-thinking-about-isis
Good reading. Particularly Judt.
Good reading. Particularly Judt.
When Bush said that we are fighting terrorism ‘there’ so that we won’t have to fight them ‘here’, he was making a very distinctively American political move. It is certainly not a rhetorical trope that makes any sense in Europe, [where politicians recognise that] if we begin a war between Western values and Islamic fundamentalism, in the manner so familiar and self-evident to American commentators, it won’t stay conveniently in Baghdad. It is going to reproduce itself thirty kilometres from the Eiffel Tower as well
Jeeeeeesus Richard Dawkins is such a cunt.
Don't call him "clock boy" since he never made a clock. Hoax Boy, having hoaxed his way into the White House, now wants $15M in addition!https://twitter.com/RichardDawkins/status/669098728662409216
By KingGondo Go To PostJeeeeeesus Richard Dawkins is such a cunt.You missed the one where he compared Ahmed to ISIS:
https://twitter.com/RichardDawkins/status/669098728662409216
The twitter background celebrating (his own) intellectual curiosity goes so well with him tweeting all this rank dogmatism.
Dawkins will forever be a special piece of shit for acting like child molestation back in the 50s is "mild pedophilia that just happened back then get over it, times were different."
By blackace Go To Postno thread yet but shit is getting real with Russiashit is getting real with turkey
like... they could've said something if russia was actually bombing them the whole time lol
The Turks are super important to this whole migrating situation. They're literally on the front lines and have a lot to say at the table.
Putin is going to have some answering to do, but something tells me he isn't the type of man that will turn the other cheek when one of his planes and comrades gets taken out in broad daylight.
Putin is going to have some answering to do, but something tells me he isn't the type of man that will turn the other cheek when one of his planes and comrades gets taken out in broad daylight.
RT @NateSilver538: What if Republicans go from winning 59% of the white vote to 62%? They win the Electoral College. https://t.co/iSZDTcIa7L
By reilo Go To PostRT @NateSilver538: What if Republicans go from winning 59% of the white vote to 62%? They win the Electoral College. https://t.co/iSZDTcIa7L
This has been their strat. Rile up as many angry white people as possible since they've fucked themselves with minorities. It's kinda of fracturing the party though.
By reilo Go To PostRT @NateSilver538: What if Republicans go from winning 59% of the white vote to 62%? They win the Electoral College. https://t.co/iSZDTcIa7L
Reagan couldn't do it, they won't either.
It's a really neat tool.
There's a million comments to be made from those stats, but one that I'm interested in is how little college education impacts partisanship. It is especially interesting since a lot of people online and on message boards such as ours like to approach politics through scientific rationality. The Republicans' attitude towards evolution and global warming does not hurt them much.
There's a million comments to be made from those stats, but one that I'm interested in is how little college education impacts partisanship. It is especially interesting since a lot of people online and on message boards such as ours like to approach politics through scientific rationality. The Republicans' attitude towards evolution and global warming does not hurt them much.
Ted Cruz’s first lead in an early state. New Monmouth Iowa poll:
Cruz – 24
Trump – 19
Rubio – 17
Carson – 13
Bush - 6
Cruz – 24
Trump – 19
Rubio – 17
Carson – 13
Bush - 6
By reilo Go To PostTed Cruz’s first lead in an early state. New Monmouth Iowa poll:
Cruz – 24
Trump – 19
Rubio – 17
Carson – 13
Bush - 6
The evangelicals turning on Carson are being sucked up by Cruz. They know Trump isn't for real.
Trump has a big lead in Iowa in the CNN poll, interesting contrast.
Also, Trump wants to stop all Muslims from entering the country because he's a fascist.
Also, Trump wants to stop all Muslims from entering the country because he's a fascist.
He's supposed to further clarify that tweet tonight I guess. Curious if he goes full blown internment camps.
By Fenderputty Go To PostHe's supposed to further clarify that tweet tonight I guess. Curious if he goes full blown internment camps.
His immigration shit was ripped directly from Ann Coulter so expect to see his Muslims in camps shit (if he goes there) to be ripped directly from Michelle Malkin:
http://www.amazon.com/In-Defense-Internment-Racial-Profiling/dp/0895260514
Since it's Pearl Harbor day.
Incredible how Malkin and Coulter have so much influence for today's GOP.
Cruz's response is "well, my plan is a little different, but we're pretty close"
Cruz and Trump are evil.
I read some Twitter speculation that ISIS has to think that Cruz and Trump are gifts from Allah and prove that they are Allah's favored sons and really, it would be hard for them not to get that impression.
