Re: About *that* GAF Drama (NO MORE GAF LINKS)

By Cymbal Head Go To PostThis is a pretty nihilistic way to approach posting on a message board.

I don't see how, but whatever.

By Kimosabae Go To PostI don't see how, but whatever.

I've had my opinions change via online discussion. Granted it wasn't one discussion but many that helped make the change.

By Kimosabae Go To PostI don't see how, but whatever.

If you're going to post about differences of opinion but simultaneously believe that it's impossible to change minds, what's left? Affiliative signalling? At that point you're essentially asking for an echo chamber, which is what you were criticizing in the first place.

The backfire effect isn't an inviolable law of human nature.

By Fenderputty Go To PostI've had my opinions change via online discussion. Granted it wasn't one discussion but many that helped make the change.

It's not that I don't think people's opinions can change - else I wouldn't post on forums at all.

It's that the person I'm dialoguing with isn't typically the person I'm hoping to convince anymore. I fully believe two people, while engaged in discourse, are less likely to be fully-open to each other's opinions than sometime after-the-fact. So the conversation is more about who might be reading than the person I'm actually engaging with. I try to see the conversations as platforms and little more.

By Kimosabae Go To PostIt's not that I don't think people's opinions can change - else I wouldn't post on forums at all.

It's that the person I'm dialoguing with isn't typically the person I'm hoping to convince anymore. I fully believe two people, while engaged in discourse, are less likely to be fully-open to each other's opinions than sometime after-the-fact. So the conversation is more about who might be reading than the person I'm actually engaging with. I try to see the conversations as platforms and little more.

Got it.

When I said your post wasn't convincing, I meant I found it unlikely to convince anyone (including observers).

But I see where you're coming from here and it's defensible.

By Kimosabae Go To PostIt's not that I don't think people's opinions can change - else I wouldn't post on forums at all.

It's that the person I'm dialoguing with isn't typically the person I'm hoping to convince anymore. I fully believe two people, while engaged in discourse, are less likely to be fully-open to each other's opinions than sometime after-the-fact. So the conversation is more about who might be reading than the person I'm actually engaging with. I try to see the conversations as platforms and little more.

I'm with Fender tbh.

You can't just diagnose people on the spot if they're gonna be receptive to a change of heart or opinion. Going through my PMs on the way out of GAF really spelled that out for me. I've changed a lot over my 10 years and 50,000+ posts (god it hurts to type that) and I know I've changed enough people that it mattered a little bit.

Making a full time job out of it is where the hell is imo

By DY_nasty Go To Post50,000+ posts

By NinjaFridge Go To Post

By DY_nasty Go To PostI'm with Fender tbh.

You can't just diagnose people on the spot if they're gonna be receptive to a change of heart or opinion. Going through my PMs on the way out of GAF really spelled that out for me. I've changed a lot over my 10 years and 50,000+ posts (god it hurts to type that) and I know I've changed enough people that it mattered a little bit.

Making a full time job out of it is where the hell is imo

That's not what I did. I just expressed my general philosophy for posting on forums. If you truly believe you can change any/everyone's mind on the internet with discourse, in the moment, it will become a full-time job. Full-stop. The Backfire Effect is a psychological affliction that is human. It affects everyone, including myself, to some degree, and the only thing we can do to combat it is to be aware that it exists. I'm not saying it's impossible for a 1v1 discourse to change someone's mind in the moment, but I believe those events are rare outliers that involve people with a certain type of conditioning amiable to that.

When all is said and done, it's largely inconsequential to how I deal with people on forums. You just won't find me involved in a pages long debates with someone because not only do I not have the time, it's conveniently fruitless.

By Kimosabae Go To PostThat's not what I did. I just expressed my general philosophy for posting on forums. If you truly believe you can change any/everyone's mind on the internet with discourse, in the moment, it will become a full-time job. Full-stop. The Backfire Effect is a psychological affliction that is human. It affects everyone, including myself, to some degree, and the only thing we can do to combat it is to be aware that it exists. I'm not saying it's impossible for a 1v1 discourse to change someone's mind in the moment, but I believe those events are rare outliers that involve people with a certain type of conditioning amiable to that.

When all is said and done, it's largely inconsequential to how I deal with people on forums. You just won't find me involved in a pages long debates with someone because not only do I not have the time, it's conveniently fruitless.

oh pff, i was just speaking more on fender's point than your's in particular

its full-time, and generally not all that rewarding.