It kinda is the film's fault. The Joker isn't going to be portrayed as a tragic sidenote. He'll go from a sadsack dork no one cares about or wants to be to a murderer everyone knows and iconizes. It's irresponsible as hell
How is it responsible? Even if it led to shootings, I think it will be wild that people will look at this movie as the cause, when the enablers of the recent massacres goes relatively unpunished.
I dont want to speak much about it because we haven't watched it yet. Still it's damning that we are wondering about the effect that this movie would do, over if it will make any crazy white person to pick up a gun to cause a massacre.
I dont want to speak much about it because we haven't watched it yet. Still it's damning that we are wondering about the effect that this movie would do, over if it will make any crazy white person to pick up a gun to cause a massacre.
It fetishizes it, by making it so fun to watch. Phoenix plays it so goddamn well that it will become instant iconography. Gonna see this shit used for all kinds of wrong reasons.
The thing is, the movie as is really only exists because the world is already behaving as is. Feels like more fire to the fuel, you know?
It should at least make everyone leave the theatre disgusted at Joker, offended by the movie even. Instead, it will be celebrated.
By Flutter Go To PostHow is it responsible? Even if it led to shootings, I think it will be wild that people will look at this movie as the cause, when the enablers of the recent massacres goes relatively unpunished.
I dont want to speak much about it because we haven't watched it yet. Still it's damning that we are wondering about the effect that this movie would do, over if it will make any crazy white person to pick up a gun to cause a massacre.
The thing is, the movie as is really only exists because the world is already behaving as is. Feels like more fire to the fuel, you know?
It should at least make everyone leave the theatre disgusted at Joker, offended by the movie even. Instead, it will be celebrated.
Yeah I get that. I also agree that Joker might be celebrated than hated. Look at what Scarface meant to some. Taxi Driver. Fight Club.
I think what we should do is ban these kinds of films from the United States because the people there can't be trusted with any sort of discourse.
I think what we should do is ban these kinds of films from the United States because the people there can't be trusted with any sort of discourse.
Discourse around the Joker is reaching moral panic levels. May as well argue that video games are the source of violence and Dungeons and Dragons or Harry Potter turn kids into satanists.
By Perfect Blue Go To PostDiscourse around the Joker is reaching moral panic levels. May as well argue that video games are the source of violence and Dungeons and Dragons or Harry Potter turn kids into satanists.It's different, we are taking about a character that was already adopted as symbol for a dangerous group of people and it talks about a loner that feels like he hasn't been accepted by society and through death and caos becomes a popular figure with followers, something that is the dream of many in that particular sub-culture.
Now, while this movie movie won't turn someone into a killer and things like 8chan, Twitter and Reddit are probably more on a incentive for those people to go on a killing spree, there's a definitely danger about The Joker being misinterpreted by many but that's a risk with many pieces of media.
By LFMartins86 Go To PostIt's different, we are taking about a character that was already adopted as symbol for a dangerous group of people and it talks about a loner that feels like he hasn't been accepted by society and through death and caos becomes a popular figure with followers, something that is the dream of many in that particular sub-culture.i don't think gamers really count as a dangerous group of people.
Now, while this movie movie won't turn someone into a killer and things like 8chan, Twitter and Reddit are probably more on a incentive for those people to go on a killing spree, there's a definitely danger about The Joker being misinterpreted by many but that's a risk with many pieces of media.
In fact I don't think I've seen the joker used seriously since the Dark Knight was very first released over 10 years ago
By sohois Go To Posti don't think gamers really count as a dangerous group of people.Pretty sure that Incel's also use Joker as a symbol and they are dangerous.
In fact I don't think I've seen the joker used seriously since the Dark Knight was very first released over 10 years ago
Not much to be done though once your established character has been co-opted by a bunch of knobends.
They'd have to change the character beyond recognition to make him unappealing to them and fend off accusations of inspiring violence. I haven't seen the film obviously, or the scene so maybe there's something in particular about it that could be linked to the alt-right and all that shit? If not, the best option is to just ignore the link and make the media you want to make.
They'd have to change the character beyond recognition to make him unappealing to them and fend off accusations of inspiring violence. I haven't seen the film obviously, or the scene so maybe there's something in particular about it that could be linked to the alt-right and all that shit? If not, the best option is to just ignore the link and make the media you want to make.
By LFMartins86 Go To PostIt's different, we are taking about a character that was already adopted as symbol for a dangerous group of people and it talks about a loner that feels like he hasn't been accepted by society and through death and caos becomes a popular figure with followers, something that is the dream of many in that particular sub-culture.People make these same arguments against video games, rock n’ roll music, Harry Potter, etc and none of it holds weight. If someone misinterprets this film to go on a killing spree, it would be absurd to blame the movie.
Now, while this movie movie won't turn someone into a killer and things like 8chan, Twitter and Reddit are probably more on a incentive for those people to go on a killing spree, there's a definitely danger about The Joker being misinterpreted by many but that's a risk with many pieces of media.
By Lunatic Go To PostAre our lives so boring that we waste time discussing this?beats complaining about football clubs by a mile tbh
The music, the framing, the actions, and everything else in those clips make it obvious that the Joker is a villain.
I have the script. He’s a piece of shit from the first page. It never asks you to sympathize with him.
Also, I have yet seen anyone post actual proof the Joker was adopted by Incels or alt-right types.
Misinterpretation can happen with any media. There are people on this forum that were full on #TeamKilmonger after Black Panther despite the movie telling you he was wrong. However, it’s the movie or the artist’s fault people are fucking idiots. This moral panic over what might happen is still not address the real problem in America. It’s just using art as a scapegoat
I have the script. He’s a piece of shit from the first page. It never asks you to sympathize with him.
Also, I have yet seen anyone post actual proof the Joker was adopted by Incels or alt-right types.
Misinterpretation can happen with any media. There are people on this forum that were full on #TeamKilmonger after Black Panther despite the movie telling you he was wrong. However, it’s the movie or the artist’s fault people are fucking idiots. This moral panic over what might happen is still not address the real problem in America. It’s just using art as a scapegoat
Yeah, I agree with Apollo that art is the scapegoat in this situation, but the Colorado shooting in 2012 was clearly done by a guy who adopted a Joker-esque persona for it.
It happens.
It happens.
Problems being addressed would mean plenty would have to be done both horizontally and vertically, institutionally and culturally.
In such a scenario a movie like Joker would be NC-17 or X, and probably never get made as a comic book movie.
But sure, the problem is specifically here and there and if we fix those two things we enter utopia.
In such a scenario a movie like Joker would be NC-17 or X, and probably never get made as a comic book movie.
But sure, the problem is specifically here and there and if we fix those two things we enter utopia.
By Flutter Go To PostYeah, I agree with Apollo that art is the scapegoat in this situation, but the Colorado shooting in 2012 was clearly done by a guy who adopted a Joker-esque persona for it.
It happens.
The investigation behind the guy concluded that he did it because he was planning it for a long time and that the Joker did not inspire it
Why would the Joker be NC-17 (which is the replacement of the X rating. They're not different)?
By Apollo Go To PostThe investigation behind the guy concluded that he did it because he was planning it for a long time and that the Joker did not inspire itWhere did it say that the joker did not inspire it?
Why would the Joker be NC-17 (which is the replacement of the X rating. They're not different)?
By Apollo Go To PostThe investigation behind the guy concluded that he did it because he was planning it for a long time and that the Joker did not inspire it
Why would the Joker be NC-17 (which is the replacement of the X rating. They're not different)?
Why should it be acceptable to sell such a stream of graphically violent content to minors?
Media also plays it's part. It got Trump to the White house, for example, or helped at least.
There are a bunch of socially isolated/socially fucked up folks who identify with Joker. That shouldn't even be under debate.
It's always the same shit tho: Travis Bickle, Tony Montana, Anthony Soprano, Walter White/Heisenberg.
Some people identify with these protagonists who take more power into their hands ignoring all the self-inflicted bullshit because they also ignore their own self-inflicted bullshit.
It's always the same shit tho: Travis Bickle, Tony Montana, Anthony Soprano, Walter White/Heisenberg.
Some people identify with these protagonists who take more power into their hands ignoring all the self-inflicted bullshit because they also ignore their own self-inflicted bullshit.
By RrusheR Go To PostWhy should it be acceptable to sell such a stream of graphically violent content to minors?
Media also plays it's part. It got Trump to the White house, for example, or helped at least.
It’s rated R. Which means minors are not allowed without an adult present
Media does have influence, media makers should be aware of what they put out there, and yet at the same time I don't like the idea of limiting character driven films about extremely flawed or "evil" protagonists because a subset of people exist that idolize them.
By Flutter Go To PostWhere did it say that the joker did not inspire it?https://www.denverpost.com/2015/09/18/meyer-the-james-holmes-joker-rumor/
https://www.cpr.org/2018/08/06/what-led-james-holmes-into-the-aurora-theater-shooting-new-book-suggests-answers-arent-likely/
Was it Joker/Batman (media influence) in that story or that mass shootings have clearly become an effective method to get people to write books about your struggles and how someone could possibly do such a thing more of a problem?
I think it's more people will glob onto anything other than what actually drives this so they point to the nearest "this is what inspired them" rather than shit healthcare, lack of institutions, lack of gun control measures or even my favorite recently, law enforcement not even enforcing laws already on the books to ensure certain people are without guns. Anything to rationalize it away from actual work and society failing on a infrastructural level.
By Apollo Go To PostIt’s rated R. Which means minors are not allowed without an adult present
Thought it meant 16+ and didn't know it worked. Over here at least you can be 16 and walk into a R rated movie without an "adult", just like you can buy an M rated game easy.
Less guns prevents mass shooters but doesn't prevent far right populism.
Either way you guys are right, it's not the art it's how it's consumed is all I'm trying to say.
By bud Go To Postbad boys 3 looks like it's being directed by a poor man's michael bay.2 Belgians in fact, they made 2 indie movies here that got a lot of attention and were not to bad at all.
But they aren't fit for a big action movie at all.
I'd expect 2008-... era Nicolas Cage style quality but saved by Will Smith & Martin Lawrence.
So a 6/10.
By Lupercal Go To Post2 Belgians in fact, they made 2 indie movies here that got a lot of attention and were not to bad at all.Oh no wonder. I thought Joe Carnahan was directing, but guess not.
But they aren't fit for a big action movie at all.
I'd expect 2008-… era Nicolas Cage style quality but saved by Will Smith & Martin Lawrence.
So a 6/10.
By Laboured Go To PostNoah Hawley's film getting panned. Sorry n8.
we’ll always have fargo
By n8 dogg Go To Postwe’ll always haveFtfyfargoLegion
By Apollo Go To PostFilm directing isn’t showrunning. Who would have thought
Idk I've heard film directors make it sound extremely analogous.
By Laboured Go To PostIdk I've heard film directors make it sound extremely analogous.
It's closer to being a producer. Showrunners hardly have shit to do with the actors during filming. Most showrunners got their start in the writing room and are mostly writers
It's official: J.J. Abrams has solidified his future at WarnerMedia.Christ these deals lately
Abrams and his wife and Bad Robot co-CEO Katie McGrath have inked a new five-year, all-encompassing overall deal with WarnerMedia. The agreement — which multiple sources say is worth more in the line of $250 million as opposed to the previously reported $500 million estimate — marks the first time that Abrams has had both his film and TV deals under the same roof. The new pact, which runs through 2024 and is described as "exclusive," also for the first time includes video games and digital content. Abrams is expected to create original feature films for WarnerMedia.
By n8 dogg Go To PostGuardian’s top 100 films of the 21st century has Ted at 60th.
What the fuck.
Bruh Team America is number 10
I'll watch Hustlers at some point, but I think it's funny that a movie about strippers apparently doesn't have much stripping from the main cast.